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Katy ISD · Special Meeting
Katy ISD Special Meeting, October 9, 2025
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- 0:02 to 2:59:54 Special Board Meeting on October 8, 2025.
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Special Board Meeting on October 8, 2025.
I hereby call this special meeting of the Board of Trustees of
Katy Independent School District to order.
Today is Wednesday, October 8th, 2025, and the time is 5.02 PM.
Dr. Grodworski, will you verify that we are in compliance with the provisions of
the Texas Open Meetings Act with regard to the notice for this meeting?
I do confirm we're in compliance with the provisions of the Texas Open Meeting
Act for a meeting tonight.
Then I would like to invite our KDIC police officer, Sergeant Pickett, to lead us in the Pledges of Allegiance.
Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
Honor the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, one state under God, one and indivisible.
Thank you.
For everyone present, we are recording this meeting. We have an audio recording here in the middle of the room.
So board members, as you participate, know that if you speak loud enough for the recording, you hear.
At this time we will move on to public comment, but we do not have anybody signed up to speak.
So we will end open forum.
And we will now, we have closed meeting on the agenda, but do not have any items that
we will be discussing.
So we will continue on in open meeting.
Sorry, sir, I'm present.
Yes.
We're not, we don't have any closed.
We have closed meeting on the agenda, but there were not any items to be discussing.
Can we arrange for that? Could the attorney, Mr. Brown?
Sure, yeah, sure, request that. Alright, well then, we will go into closed meeting.
The board will now convene and closed meeting is authorized under section 551.001 of the Texas Government Code for the following purposes.
Texas. Texas Government Code 551.071, 551.074, and 551.129.
The board will now reconvene in open meeting. Today is Wednesday, October 8, 2025, and the time is 519.
On behalf of my colleagues, I welcome everybody to today's special board meeting.
The board has just reconvened from closed meeting in accordance with chapter 551 of the Texas Government Code.
any action arising from discussions and closed meeting must be taken in an open
meeting we'll now move on to item six discussion for governance review the
roles rights and responsibilities of the board we've invited dr. Robert long
division director at a speed board development services and Jason Bergen
as a board consultant to come and lead our team building today I'll turn it
over to you, Dr. Long.
I'm sure everyone can hear me well.
Good evening, Mr. President, wonderful board meeting members.
Thank you all for having us here today.
This is definitely a really great treat.
Like I said, I'm Robert.
Most of you guys know me from either one way or another, but in our time together, tonight
We're just going to take some time to really start to deal with a framework around how you guys move forward as a governance team
I know it's not a secret your board president has some pretty ambitious
Objectives or awards I would say for you guys and
totally like what you guys are producing when it comes to student outcomes and then just even the gravitas that
KDISD carries around the state is something that a lot of school districts around the state looks at and say like how do we do
duplicate that? How do we replicate that? And even in my conversations with Texas Education
Agency officials, they always say that when it comes to dealing with all the complexity
of issues that we have and dealing with today's youth and preparing them for our future economy
and getting them ready for that legacy that you all have built, Katie is really setting
the standard for that. And so, I know, Lance, that you shared with them kind of like your
idea of like where you want to take this team as president, like a governance core, like
what your ideas are some of those discussions because that's really what we're first of all
going to check and see like you know are we at a place for those actions to be able to happen and
that's an honest conversation that can be had and then having a conversation is like what should the
focus be if that is the case if we're all in and we think that this is the direction that we want
to go to really elevate and be that stable and standard um and then to like how does this all
this really impact our students right because you guys are all here because
you love kids you all here giving up your time everyone in here is
sacrificing something right now from their family life or their work life and
so really wrecking and recognizing and honoring that something that is unique
is I am presenting as board development consults board division record for
development services for TASB Jason is an independent consultant so he's
non-associated affiliated with TASB whatsoever but we are co-presenting
together based on our board president here. Did I cover it? Did you want to talk about the goals?
Yeah, I mean I shared a couple weeks ago, when everybody was there, looking at districts or even successful teams, like there's usually a small window where you can achieve kind of great things and you think
Think about Dallas Cowboys in 93, 94.
They had a great coach and a great team,
and they were able to put together two world championships.
You get some other teams that they string some things together.
You look at the Patriots with Bill Check and Tom Brady,
and I think our district is continually knocking it out of the park on academics
and not perfect by any means but successful in almost every single area
in comparison around the state in comparison in our comparable districts
in our region and I would think our board to do that too and so that doesn't
mean that we're uniforms I didn't mean that we're the same right but we can
we can be unified but unified not uniform and so everybody has the ability
to have their opinions and think what they think but still be able to work
together and so I believe we can do it here tonight was just what are those
steps we take that can we take one step forward can we take ten steps forward
and then tonight is just let's take that first step so that's what I've asked
Robert and Jason to help lead us there. Yeah so one thing to be sure you're not
gonna learn anything from us like we're not here to teach you at all like we're
just here to help organize a structured conversation so that safety security and
belonging is utmost secured and protected so that people can have honest
dialogue about the work because the policy that you said impacts generations
generations and cohorts of kids and I say that not just flaunting it out there
I'm a product of a locally controlled school board that did something for me
that my own father wouldn't do for me like I would not be here without
Livingston ISD and the seven school board members that took hold of me when
I should have been every statistics you know when I talk about when I talk about
my life in public schools did that they provided for me a safe haven from a very
abusive stepfather from a dad who didn't want me from all the things and so by all statistics
i should be wearing orange um but i'm not and neither is my sister neither is my brother
they're all killing it in life and that's one because we got an amazing mom who was who still
is doing amazing things she's single mom and she has done everything she's she goes to church three
times a week she gives her ties an offering like she's you know good old east texas florida um
And she had a great mom who was Dixie, who was the same thing, but I also had amazing trustees in my community that were setting policy that provided opportunities and access.
You know, so that I could go to Angelina College in Lufkin, I could take my PSAT for free, you know, I could do those things.
You know, my mom, the biggest thing about driving to Lufkin was she got to stop at Long John Silver's when I took PSAT.
She was not excited about me taking PSAT. It was just that long John Seavers up there, but
But we went she didn't even know what the PSAT was at the time as I recall but and that's what we're going to
Talk about because most of the policy that you guys shape although you see the benefits that it does for students. We oftentimes don't
Cut the policy doesn't necessarily touch you directly and so we just want to level set around a couple things
things there. Jason got anything to add?
So yeah, you're not going to learn anything from us. We're just here to facilitate the conversation.
I was going to say I have a lot of respect for all of you being here tonight.
Like there's lots of other things you could be doing. I've sat in that seat before, I know what it's like.
And so your willingness to come together is really cool.
So one of the, so we're going to norm develop as we form through the evening.
at any time that there is a need for someone,
a need for safety, security, belonging,
the president is gonna be monitoring that
and we'll take a deep pause because sometimes we do,
you know, it's about kids, right?
Your job is you produce human capital,
hopefully that will come back and invest in a community
that is KD and be part of that legacy,
that is to be the legacy that's in every building, right?
How do we sustain that, how do we keep that going?
Also, to Lance's point about the Dallas Cowboys,
is you only have the right ingredients for a certain amount of time to make
that more magic happen right like there's only there's a limited time for
that so when you're talking about things like the HEB Excellence Awards for
outstanding school boards they're gonna look at the student outcomes but they're
also going to look at are they doing the work that is helping produce that are
they working collaboratively as a governance team however you define that
to ensure that you're safe we're setting policy that is impacting the classroom
in a way that produces positive outcomes and then are we making sure that the
community voices in that as well right and making sure that whatever goals that
we set as a board or a body corporate is in alignment with those goals and
responsibilities so we're going to start here and just talk about our session
outcomes so this is just the beginning of the work I would like to talk about a
good stop time we have set like I know in the calendars I said like that 830
but sometimes the cognitive dissonance might be too much and we might just have
to disconnect for a minute and that's okay because again you know this is the
only job where your product is a human child or like you're developing human
beings right so this is the beginning if this is to run its full course there
will be several sessions where we'll come back like for example thank you for
filling out your board stuff assessments like that is aligned with the SBOE
framework for school board development so the comments gives great feedback
We're not going to get to that tonight. That's going to be a later session because there's a lot to unpack there, right?
But for all intents and purposes, we want to really talk about, you know, what is our shared commitment around students?
So how do we view that? Like, and because everyone has a different perception,
you know, because perception is reality and we all grew up and went to public schools and we have that perception of what that is.
But then as board members, as policymakers,
makers how do we shift that into being like how do we understand other people's
perspective and how do we wrap our heads around what someone else's perspective
because you guys are the voice between the community to the superintendent so
how do you jump into the perspective of your of your community members and then
bring that up and then from there we're hoping to have a conversation around
let's let's clarify some roles like our lanes right because people have
different ideas of what's what's governance versus what's management
Let's have that discussion. We'll share some research as best practice and then
you guys decide like what that looks like here in KDISD. That may not be
solved tonight and that's okay, right? But just to start that conversation. And then
stronger super, stronger board superintendent trust. Like we know that
teams move effectively at the speed of trust. So how do we get to that level of
trust so that there is unity and coherence there? And then let's talk
about concrete monitoring practices and again that's a longer down the road
conversation but like how do we monitor because your job entrusted to you by the
state of Texas and by administrative code is that you are to authorize but
also make sure that you're monitoring that what your vision is for the
community is actually being realized through the role and so those are our
beginning session conversation. So I want to start with a little bit of a question.
So one of the norms that I would like to help everyone if everyone can help me
with this. So there's only one person speaking at a time if we could all like
so whoever speaking just let them finish their comment and conversation because I
really want to make sure that we're hearing. My mom always said you have two
of these and one of these for a reason sometimes um as adults it's hard for it's hard for me like
my wife always looks at me and says why don't you be quite a little bit and i'm working on that um
but i want to take a little time just to frame a little bit about why we're here and so my first
cue to you all um and you know i actually i'm gonna pick someone to start i think i will direct
and pick who starts but i would ask in that time that we respect safety security and belonging and
making sure that we are the only person speaking and then we're going to go a
little exercise we're going to just like reflect on what that person said and
then we'll move on to the next person are we good with that sir how does
statistics professor at A&M you know he was German who say sir I don't actually
know if that's German or you just saying but I do that sometimes so and this
really is framing around while we're here so like if and here's the prompt
name one board action so name one board action that is done consistently this
year would improve most would most improve student outcomes so if you name
one board action that if it was done consistently this year it would prove
most improved student outcomes think about that for a minute and I'm going to
ask mr. cross to start us off there but just sort it
Probably, I mean, I'm trying to think about this as I go, but probably for us it's just the communication piece with our superintendent.
because like being on the management side of it all those years and now
stepping into the governance side I find myself having to make sure that you know
it's easy to slip back into management piece and you know what I look at is
what you you mentioned the monitoring piece and I know that's down the road
but what I think about is that's really what we do here. We are monitoring like
what are what are the programs we have, what are we looking at doing, everything
from you know what's the benefit and the downside of say a virtual high school
for our district when we're looking to grow Miller Career Center and that's
going to have a direct impact on student outcomes you know. Was at a meeting
earlier with an HCC was talking about you know throw in the dual credit
program and and how many kids he said 5,000 kids in Katy are taking dual
credit classes direct impact on student outcomes so I guess you know in my mind
I'm not I don't and this is me being a new board member I probably just not
savvy or knowledgeable enough to know that one action so in my mind what I'm
thinking is we I don't know that there's one policy one magic policy that we come
up with that no it's you know poof and student outcomes happen I think it's
more like are we having those conversations are we when we're what are
we putting on our agendas you know each month I think that matters you know are
we are we putting things that we're talking about if up on the dais we're
having regular conversations about student learning, student outcomes. I
think our community sees that as well. I think our community goes, wow, they're
they're talking about these things that's going to directly impact my child
and how well they do. Whether they're going to college military workforce when
we have presenters and they come, you know, from our district folks and they're
talking about our CCMR and and it is it's a great time for us to ask
questions about that like that we we don't know and even you know I mean it's
been three years since I've retired and so there have been a lot of you know
changes in the public school world that that I'm not aware of nor am I an expert
in anything you know just you like to think you learn it you learn something
and in 30 years but certainly there's a lot that I didn't know and still don't
So I guess for me, I think of it as I can't think of a specific action more so than that the monitoring piece, the conversation piece, what we're focusing on from month to month, what goes on that agenda.
And if it were always just, you know, I don't know, like we're only talking about the tax rate all year.
I mean, it's important.
As we know, the community cares about that.
We had the national night out, you know, last night in the neighborhood.
And we were sitting around.
And one of the gentlemen in our neighborhood, he knows I'm on the board now.
He likes to tease me.
So we get together and he says something like, yeah, James over there is not bringing my taxes.
down here you know and they all have been you know I said and I like to you
know have fun with them back and go talk to the state of Texas you know and and
so anyway I say that to say that those things matter and you have to address
them and there's a time and a place and obviously we have a schedule for that
but to me it's the first thing I see is if I'm looking as a citizen of this
community I'm looking at what what does our board talk about month in and month
out and and then what you know how are we monitoring that progress and and that
has to happen through you know data we receive conversations we have with our
superintendent and with one another and that we can sit and talk about those
things and say I'm really proud of this I'm concerned about this and so I
probably have talked too long no I get it no I appreciate that and sometimes
you see the space that they have to say it a lot what I think a lot of the
public don't understand is there's not like a lot of spaces for board members
to get together and just have conversations that's the one thing I've
learned from my years of working with over a hundred school board trustees
that are from different districts that travel from the travel around the state
together it's been three to four days together is they they yearn for the
spaces to have the conversation just to be able to process because you guys are
flooded with so much information all the time all the emails everything and it's
hard to have a space to process it because of all the things that you have
have to do so that kids eat and get served and get educated because the end
the list never ends right so but what I think I heard you say James is you said
a little bit about superintendent communication but then it shifted to
more of saying you know no I just think there if one action would be continuing
that flow of communication but also making sure that we're monitoring those
measurable objectives so that we have the ability to communicate to the
community right is I was summing up so those would be two of those actions that
you would put in place that would tremendously improve student outcomes
why because there would be alignment allegedly right perceived alignment
between the superintendent and the board and then two there would be transparency
in like how it was monitored because then you could direct the community to
hey go back and look at this agenda hey go back and look at you know this and
and they could see that there was coherence,
sort of similar to your guys' strategic design plan, right?
Similarly to that, right?
So thank you for that.
Thanks for letting me go first.
No, I mean, hey, I just randomly.
No, I'm not.
Thank you for taking all the good ideas.
Well, you know, it's a thought process,
so thank you for your time.
And I'm gonna say, same question, Amy.
I'd be curious to know,
So again, if you could name one action that have done consistently this year would most
improve student outcomes.
Yeah, it's something I've talked about a lot since I've been on board.
And funny thing is I've done almost all of my call up my campus visits this year.
Every single teacher has brought it up to me.
Almost every single campus that I visited.
So that's pretty unique.
But I think we need to do a better job of prioritizing protecting teacher planning time.
It's not happening.
And these teachers, they are overburdened.
And I know if we have to put more resources into it,
then we need to put more resources into it.
But I'm getting incredible pushback on that issue,
and that saddens me.
And I have made numerous, numerous suggestions,
and all of them are shot down.
Can I ask a clarifying question? Sure. Is that just like your instructional FTE
teachers? Is that support instructional staff? I think it's all. It's both. It's that,
everything. Protecting teacher planning time. And then can I ask another
clarifying question? Sure. You're talking exclusively like their established
conference time, right? Okay.
Especially at the elementary level,
that's where it's the worst.
So I need to refine this and tweak it a little bit.
So what I hear you saying is that if there is one action
that the board could take, it would be a shift
of some type of direction or policy or goal
that would ensure the protection of all instructional staff planning time.
Right, basically the answer is we're doing everything we can do where there's
no reason to change anything. But I mean I'm almost 10 out of 10 campuses that I
visit, I speak to teachers that are struggling. I'm like, well there's a problem.
So I know a teacher that's brand new to teaching, she left, she left after two
weeks. What her name? She said I graduated from college. She worked in KDIC for about two weeks.
And she called me and she said I'm done. I can't handle it. So I appreciate that. You know, one of the things
that we have been having conversation in some of my peer group is around that, you know, it used to
be that we're losing teachers to other competing districts. Now we're losing them to like HEB and
Amazon and you know when I recently visited the Armony which is like Charles
buts HVB corporate office or whatever they were saying that their number one
recruit for their stores or high school football coaches and principals like
they do the best at managing their stores because they literally have to
learn like every department before they can ascend so it's like to your point
about keeping highly qualified instructional staff that impact kids
every day right like those are those student outcomes those are all those
accolades that these but I think it also speaks to James's piece about that
coherence and alignment right because you know if we feel like when we're
getting reports that we're hearing you know the real thing right but then when
we have personal interactions in our community because you are the liaison
between the community and the superintendent right there's there's
almost like a mandate or obligation to figure out like where is that not
flushing out it right and so I appreciate you sharing that and so we're
gonna talk and and tackle that as well how about you miss Fox do you want me to
say the question again or no sir the one action I know I know but we're just
starting with one guys all right okay so so I have three obviously it's down
one to one okay I think one of the most beneficial to a seasoned board member
what is the learning walks I think the learning walks that we've been on have
while I know the campuses I've been there before but in the end of the
season I'm in here and my focus is different than it was when I first joined
the school board we went to Raines High School we went to the OAC my campus
visits that I'm in the midst of doing now I learned something at each of those
especially in our campus visits because so many things have changed right the
HMH and in many of our CTE programs and things and as I go around and see them
the student outcomes are improving and I see educators just finding new
refining the way they deliver instruction or how they reach students from every zip code and every
grade level and it just renews my spirit about why KDSD continues to be at the very top even
when it's harder and more struggles and changing statistics. So doing that gives
me clarity and I think all of us clarity on the kinds of things that we can have
an impact on because our role at this table is
It's not ideas as much as it is, like Mr. Cross said, conversations with the superintendent
and then, oh that could work and we could do that.
Do we have space and finances and all the things that could make a new program happen?
it or how can we redefine what the OSC looks like still still serve that
population but save money so that we can do new ideas like those kinds of things
excite me and I think that all of those points do not go so innovation but I was
can you because I'm ignorant so can you help me with like learning walks and
just understand because they look different in every different district so
so that I understand as we're having these conversations,
what your idea of learning walk is and what that all entails.
Well, so the superintendent sets up a tour of one of our programs,
two of our programs, it was Raines High School and the OAC.
And then whichever trustees are available to go and
just walk through the campus and have the principal say, these are the children we
serve, meet some of them, ask them what impact they have, go through.
here's how we use our building as we're redesigning OAC we walked through and
learned how what they're doing how they do it how they could do it differently
what works and why it's important and and it campuses the principal does the
same thing walks us around I don't know what your campus visits look like are
Are they similar?
Walk you around to look in class.
peek in classrooms, observe a few minutes here and there.
And of course they're only going to show us positive things,
but those positive things are impressive.
They are.
And I, on my, I ask two questions to every principal.
What's your greatest joy and what's your greatest challenge?
And they're just about, the answers are just about the same throughout.
that. Thank you for sharing. So the innovation piece of course is there
because Katy is known for its innovation and a lot of the programs and just I
know you guys already know this but I see this when I travel the state that
people other districts they want to emulate what you guys have here in this
legacy and that's not to say that everything's perfect because we know
it's not like it's human beings there's lots of things that we could always do
better but you guys as set the standard and the bar really high for what you do
for kids here in the region so and I would add for you dr. long our reigns
high school is a non-traditional school yes it's beautiful school right oh
that's right you brought this yeah it's the coolest thing I've ever it's the
I mean I'm not I mean oh my god so really pretty white and how many kids
that have their degree their diplomas because of that because a lot of those
like I have cousins that probably would not like put that would I'm not be
felons now if they had a traditional like a non-traditional setting like that
and then the principal is just phenomenal but here you're saying like
the fitness equipment so they can understand how to utilize like I mean
that could be intimidating to some kids that's that's a thing which then is
against him I mean it's just so yeah really good stuff even if you've been
like you've left school and you've come back and it's it's not an immediate oh
I'm back now I'm successful but it's a little bit like adults who will check in
on you and keep coming and just because it's not easy you just keep coming and
other kids who look like them it just feels a need that is crucial because
these are the ones that are mostly juniors and seniors I would guess or at
least high school ready for the world yeah I want to dig into that just a
little bit because I will tell you guys um the opportunity like the opportunity
like the opportunity that this board has to like really cultivate and shape.
You guys have a proven committed team with Dr. Gorskin and his team that has done some amazing things
and you guys get to like sort of set the North Star for what that is.
There's lots of opportunities. I want to say that because, man, Reigns is just really, really amazing and I appreciate it.
But the impact was, we did have the chance to visit with leadership to ask me, it's crazy because you have all these trustees that go out and speak to their trustees and they say like, so you don't even know the impact that you make.
It's just like expanded upon.
Yeah, I mean it turned into a whole project where they're like checking out how many dropouts and one of the trustees was actually having a report like how many kids they're losing that were in some of the same circumstances.
I mean it it turned into and and that's all because of the work that you guys I
mean even the CDL truck driving commercial truck driving thing was a
favorite thing like that was they went back to Permian Dacian Midlands she went
back there and started having conversations about how can we get some
I mean people didn't even know it was a thing like things that they and so it's
it's just oh it's just so amazing that they don't get and so when they're so
even when they're infused with because a lot of people in leadership tasks we are
like from really rural districts and so when they're infused with you know like
a Don or Lance or you know a Morgan into that class like they really learn a lot
from they're like wow we didn't even know we could do that there was a lot of
that like right am I telling you anything incorrect I mean Rebecca you
went through not when I was but you you know like it might like there was a lot
of that and you don't know where else would you get that anyway I think we have an
education foundation because I thought I found on my year yeah I love it um
Morgan same question one action if done consistently would improve student
outcomes
when we look at what they're faced with.
You know, when we look at planning time,
and it's not just planning time.
We've heard from numerous teachers
about their healthcare insurance.
And we've tried to adjust that, we've tried to look at that,
and this is a beast of a thing to climb over,
but how are our students supposed to be able to succeed
when their teachers are concerned
about the health of their spouse,
or the health of their own children,
or the medical bills that are piling up that they're not going to be able to pay,
that their salaries don't meet, that they're now in debt,
that they can't afford groceries, that they can't afford clothes on their back,
that they can't afford the gas,
and then somehow they're supposed to magically pour into 20 or 30-some-odd kids.
Or 150.
Or 150.
Like, that's not realistic.
They're not superheroes.
Yes, they are.
Like, we like to say that, but they're not.
They're human beings.
who are having to survive in the same economy that we all are,
that are facing all of the same things that we all are.
And so when we look at the amount of burden that we're putting on their backs
and then expecting magic to happen, it's an unrealistic expectation.
And so when you look at your story specifically,
prison is a pipeline, like the pipeline prison.
You look at that.
Well, what is the biggest determiner of that?
Fourth-rate literacy rates.
grades. Fourth grade literacy grades have a direct correlation to whether a child
will end up in prison. So I get that we have really really great things here and
I'm not doubting that. I've seen it. My problem is I look at this and I say okay
But how are we to the student who's performing the lowest?
When I go to one of the elementary schools that performs really, really high,
well, it's great because they're motivated parents, motivated students,
motivated teachers, but you have communal input pushing that student forward.
When I go to Sundown Elementary, it doesn't look like that.
So give me the graduation rates and give me the prison statistics of the kids that came from Sundown Elementary and then tell me something different.
We're only as good as our weakest student. So if I have a kid that graduates high school that can't read, that's unacceptable.
even if it's one that's unacceptable so and it's baffling when you look at the
amount of resources and you look at the not just economic wealth but the actual
true wealth of knowledge of capability of all of the things that Katie is
defaults there's no reason why we should have one graduating that way so what
what this board could do and all of that burdens back onto the teacher in the classroom.
So all of that is predicated on the person that's with them eight hours out of the day.
And if that person cannot focus because they are so overwhelmed with the stresses of their job
that are something that we can fix, but we can't, like we have too many strings attached or all of that,
that like that's that's not acceptable to me so I get that there are really
great things that we have but I look at the teachers that are struggling and I
look at the kids they're gonna continue to struggle and I look at what that
means for our future selfishly and what that means for their future and I'm
concerned does that look like recruitment you think or is it more of a
I don't know what you mean by recruitment.
I think he's looking for an action.
Yeah.
Because you talked about teacher, I mean, well, I was caught up in the passion and emotion,
so I applaud you because I was thinking, man.
This is my way.
Yeah, this is my way.
But it's, I feel like it's also me as a Title I principal having a 20 to 30% mobility rate
in an elementary campus where we enrolled 200 kids and I enrolled 200 kids in the same year,
you know and I would love to have a board member that's so passionate that
really understands that struggle and keeping great teachers in that building
because they were not coming to my school. I was doing every song and dance to get
them there but they're like I'm gonna get kicked, hit, punched, you know called this
that and the third because it really does take it takes a special kind of
person a hero to your point but it also you have to understand those teachers
are also human beings and they can only take so much, you know, and we have like as a society we have pushed
teachers to the brink. To Jason's point, my wife included, she's had some really rough years here of recent and late,
but she gets up every morning and she goes and I will tell you this,
I also appreciate you because I was that fifth grade teacher that graduated from college and
you know, we got paid once a month and Brian I. Steve, once a month, can you remember these days?
Once a month, my check after taxes was $958. My rent was $505. I was broke the rest of the week.
I was broke as a joke. The insurance wasn't that good. I ran out of money.
To your point, as you were telling that story, I remember, because again, the point I'm at in my life now is
when I'm listening to someone, and I've learned this more as you work with boards across the state,
is as you know everyone talks about perception is reality and that's true but like when you're
in that governance lane and you're a policy maker where you're like thinking 20 years 10 years 30
years down the road for a community that doesn't know what that vision should look like that's in
your charge i try to like flip my perspective and so i say that to say like when you were telling
me that i was flipping back to like okay i understand or even when i was a principal and
i had a really disruptive kid this is right after coven um or right before code sorry i had a really
disruptive kid who had just no socialization bless his heart mom tried
to do everything but he was so just he needed so much help and support and
structure and he didn't have that and I had to move him from every kindergarten
teacher out of fear of just trauma from just the daily of dealing you know and
like what toll is and I knew I had one teacher who didn't want him moved she
was like oh no I love him we're not moving him but she was with child and
her husband showed up at my office one day I was like oh I got it you know what
I mean like that I was like as a dad as a husband I would have a hit you know
and I had to tell my assistant suit and say like I'm going to have to do this
against what the mom wants and what the teachers want but this is what's best
for the kids so I say I applaud you for having the passion to keep that on the
prove you so but Jason was pushing and asking for like the teacher action I
think how you recruit a team I think I don't know how recruitment necessarily
means that because how do I go out and tell a freshly graduated college teacher
hey I've got a cool opportunity for you you're gonna get paid crap your
healthcare insurance is gonna suck you're gonna have no control of your
kids in your classroom your parents may be kind of apathetic to the entire
system when you get in there but it's really rewarding come on now recruitment
like that like yeah KDIC in and of itself is a recruitment of its own
that's they want to come here what are they staying here so we as KDIC
are they happy right right are they happy are they staying longevity wise
are we seeing more people get here and then retire out of here or are we seeing
them get here and then burn out like a flash in the pan so I kind of just said
like taking care of teachers the Katie way like and like sort of like that
would be the action like when we're looking at an agenda or even looking at
how we plan out agendas like what are those measures that you're getting those
types of answers right one of the things that we saw was because we even gave
voice and we even had the the conversation about their health care
insurance because we even pulled that out and discussed that multiple times to
to show them, hey, we see you, we want to hear from you,
and we want to speak to that,
and we want to push on what we can.
That makes a huge difference.
It makes a huge difference.
Now, talking to the teacher.
But am I circling in the right area, or am I off?
Yeah, I mean, you have to take care.
Because I'm working for y'all, so y'all tell me.
Yes, in my opinion, you have to take care of teachers.
So we're talking about healthcare.
We're talking about like...
And it's kind of where I was going to go,
it's like, if you're being treated very well and fair,
you can deal with a lot of stuff.
Right.
Right, so that's kind of where I was, you know,
because it's a whole encompassing,
there's a lot of things there,
but if you're treated really well,
you can deal with it.
And talk is cheap.
Yeah.
So, you can say that,
but you gotta talk the talk and walk the walk.
It's not enough just to say that.
Well, thank you so much for that,
and I appreciate the passion.
Like, I grew up in the Southern Baptist Church,
so don't make me run around.
And I mean,
when people start preaching
and they love kids and they love teachers,
like, you're speaking my language, because I was
that principal, but you know, principals always get up
and they say, I'm sorry, this is just my bit, and I'll stop.
But principals get up and say, I'm here for the kids,
I'm here for the kids, but like, are you here for the teachers?
Because they're the ones taking care of the kids,
because if you don't feed them, they're going to eat something.
You know? Right?
Like, I mean, I always took care of my teachers
the best of the ones that were good and precious,
and so I appreciate it you absolutely can okay so this is this is why I
struggle is like I know I maybe we don't all agree but like when Morgan's talking
I hear Rebecca you sighing that's not helpful that's not it's not something
you really want you can't be a board that is so disrespectful to other board
members when they're talking to it's a sigh and make the faces and all the
stuff you can't have that and be a productive board-winning board and I
mean I didn't know that that was what you wanted to do until you said it in
that I just cast I kind of feel like good leadership would come to the board
first and say this is what I'm thinking this one can I get your buy-in but
instead I got I maybe all knew about it before I didn't I just was stunned and I
had a couple of words of public members that were like y'all are trying for this
and I was like, this news to me, I just found out today.
I just, I mean, if collaboration is one of the things you're looking for,
we actually have no collaboration.
I agree with that.
I would like to have known what the goal was.
I had no idea.
At least if I am, in my opinion, I mean, I do represent people,
and I was voted in.
And I agree we shouldn't be sighing and rolling eyes when someone's speaking.
Be careful.
It's not nice.
So, Amy, thank you for voicing that,
Mary Ellen, thank you for chiming in.
And what I would like to say during this time, because I did promise everybody safety, security, and belonging,
and so that's of utmost importance, because my thing is leave things better than I found them.
That's really, really important to the work and integrity that I'm doing here this evening.
So what I would ask for everyone is tonight, like, we're really just going to focus on ourselves,
ourselves, like as individuals and not anyone else, but just ourselves and like what we are bringing or not bringing to the table. And if we can agree to that commitment, we can just keep it singularly focused on just what our actions are. And because everybody else's actions is going to show, right? Like I can't control anybody but Robert Long. Like sometimes I get very frustrated at my 15 and 12 year old who think they know everything. But I at the end of the day, I can only control the actions of
what Robert Long is, as policymakers, as a governance team duly elected and charged
by the state of Texas, it's critical that you guys establish a foundation because
kids are at stake. And I think you all know that, the gravitas of it is
just like, how do we find a way to do it in a way that respects everyone
and respects everyone's voice and contribution, right, but still keep us
focus on the main thing that is student outcomes and if we can agree to that and
keep it moving. I will say this is the perfect time for us to talk about our
end goal in time like like I said it's scheduled for like 830 but like our goal
is to get y'all out here by 730 and for two reasons because again like the Amy G. Dalla
may be compromised. You ever heard about the amygdala? We call it the Amy G. Dalla
because it's your fight-or-flight right like that might get compromised so we
We might have to take a little cognitive dissonance, and that's perfectly fine and okay, because this is a multi-step process.
For us tonight, it's like, where can we level set and build consensus to some agreeance, right, to move forward?
I think, and I'm not speaking for Lance, but I think one of the things that he sees, he sees potential in the team.
and he thinks that this would be a great way for us to build unity and stability
by showing this community that we can unify behind something. So you can actually
bring something that's really nice to the community because you guys really
deserve it with the work you're doing and yes there's still lots of other work
that we've got to do. There's lots of it and there's lots of contributing
factors to that right? But you guys have the power and you have the access
and you have the ability to get behind something,
and you still don't have to agree with everything.
I think the community elects you to the board
because they want that, right?
They want there to be someone to really make sure
that their voice is being elevated.
But at the same time, we have to find a way
that we have to figure out how we can do
the best work for kids, right?
And so that means that we're gonna have to be
very respectful of everyone at every time
because we're all sacrificing something. Right? We're all sacrificing something.
Right now. Somebody's giving up something. You're not at somebody's orchestras,
football, something. And two, you guys get paid nothing for this, but you take all
the punishment. Take all the punishment. All the hateful emails, Facebooks, all
that stuff. Like you get it. Especially in a hyper political community that is
Katie period on all sides right and so I understand how important this work is
and I applaud you for even taking this step but as we're moving forward I just
want to ensure that we're just focused on what we're adding to and we're not
paying attention to what anyone else is doing because their own actions will
show them.
Can we do that?
No?
That'd be great.
And 730 good with everyone
too as well?
Great. Okay.
So, move forward.
Can we continue? Because I mean,
I'm excited because I think
there's lots of
potential up here.
And so that's what I'm excited about because
guess what? Your guys are not
as out of alignment as you may think that you are based on some of your
conversations so there is room to focus and I know there's probably other things
that you know might make me change that I mean five minutes I might hear
something to say that's not the thing but like right now I feel like there's
some things that we can build upon and that's really what we're just looking
like what can we build you know we got to build somewhere because if we don't
kids suffer like and then you have we're working his team and a holding pattern
because they're trying to figure out like how to execute and that's hard to
do intentionally when you're dealing with kids you know there's lots of
moving factors when you're dealing with kids and all the things right so um so
yes miss Don okay are you do you need the question again no all right it's
hard when you go toward the end because then you hear everybody else's things
and it you know then you think of other things you have to have one thing you
has that one thing. But this is not my one thing, but I will say what I heard
ever and ever again in that Master of Thesis program, just keeping the main thing the
main thing. And there's so much to be said about that and the main thing is, we
all know what the main thing is, right? The child is the main thing. And as long
as we keep our focus on that, you know, everything else should fall into
into place. But that's not my thing that I want to say. The thing I want to say, wait a minute, that's not my thing.
Is that fair? No, no.
She's getting a bonus one.
No, James Cross said a couple things. So I just wanted to throw that in.
I also wanted to add just something else that a learning walk can be done with sub-things of schools,
Like, through the library, or through planning time. I saw a planning time in Bryan ISD that was awesome, that I sat in on.
But here's my thing. Because everybody else said so many good things, so I'm going to say something about community buy-in.
And this affects all schools, and even schools like Sundown and things like that, too.
back in the day when I was on VIPS and PTA president and all that, I would try to sell
people almost on our school. Their kid was going to be stuck at our school because they
live here. But I'm also trying to sell them at how great our school is. And I realize
that there's maybe not a person like that at every school. But the feeder pattern thing
that we do I think is good. Because if we could all a little bit take ownership in the
those schools that we've adopted as school board members, then we could be their biggest
cheerleaders. And I personally try to do that, I know I'm just one board member, but I will
periodically go to a choir concert or health resident carnival or something. And I can't
do everything, but if I could just do one thing at each school every semester, I feel
like people kind of see okay there's a board member here that cares about my
school and about our kids that go to this school and sometimes when you're talking
about your childhood and you said that you were rescued by the board members
but you know how people say you know even if I just affect one person you
know if I've given a speech or done something and it just one person heard
something so that that's the way I look at it I realize yes I want every child
to succeed in everything but if we could just you know one kid at a time you know
what I mean almost and in the long run we'll get all the kids that's my hope
but I don't know how to make that into an action plan other than we already do
have the feeder pattern assignment you know if we just really focused on we
would be the person for that school. So what I think I hear you saying, I hear the main thing,
so can you just elaborate a little bit on the main thing, the main thing, because I know people say
that a lot, but it means a lot of different things to a lot of different people because
as I travel to state people say, oh the main thing, the main thing, it means different in
the big country, Japan handle than it does in the Rio Grande Valley. So like interesting you should
say that because I think the main thing for me is the main thing in every one of those school
districts and the main thing is the child and the child's success. Okay so student outcomes
but all of those up there drive towards student health. Yes they all do and I like everyone's
input and everything um but how can we get to those kids at sundown when I've been you know
This year I'm with May Creek is my feeder pattern.
And I also had May Creek my first year I was in, and I had Morton for two years.
So I've been with the Title I schools four out of my eight years.
And what I see is really hardworking teachers who are very motivated and positive
and just hardworking.
And I just think that their children in their classes that you're right. They don't have like the parental support or whatever
which is where
We can all do a better job at being their cheerleaders because I think
And then I think that like even though we're just a board member and little first grader and then I realize
She's a board member and how one that is
But if they had a whole bunch of that kind of thing from board members, from admin, from
other community members, you know, getting more people involved from the community, the
mentorship program.
Well, I think if I could chime in for a second, like doing even a sister schools program like
we do.
A sister school program?
where you, you know, you take a school that does have a large PTA, very involved, raising money,
and they will help schools that don't, so that they, you know, those kids and those teachers get those benefits as well.
A lot of things are community-bound, like Dr. Gregorski and his people and his staff, I think Karen Lewis,
I'm involved with the Scouting of America, I'm on their board, and now we're letting in scouts more.
And I mean this is just this is just part of the community and especially in those Title I schools
Where they can see these programs up there that are after school programs or positive things
House program, where they go to meet with kids
Just things that I know we already do but I think we could just do more and more and more
I don't think there's an ending point. There's not going to be a
There's a ending line and now we're here. It'll never be like that
It's always potential for growth in that.
And I appreciate you saying that, Don.
So you talk about community outreach and all those, but I also hear that there's sort of a through line here to like Morgan's too.
Like where it's just like, okay, but I do realize that there's some kids that we're not getting to.
So like how can we, and would you also say conversely with teachers?
Yes, but so like, can I just show you an example real quick?
One year when I was with one of the schools across town, they had the children's museum
come out at night.
And it was actually at May Creek Elementary with Alicia Sheedy.
It was so exciting.
And she did all this advertising.
And she did all this thing.
And I think ten parents came.
But it was a free.
And I mean, because my kids used to belong, you know, we had membership to children's
museum.
It was expensive to go to children's museum.
And they brought all, everybody out there.
and they had all the different things, you know, like it was all set up, the stations and everything.
I stayed the whole two hours.
I think maybe ten families came through.
And it is a problem, you know, because it's not that that wasn't offered
and communicated a hundred different ways, but how do you, I mean, the little kids can't drive, you know.
Yeah.
How do you get the parents to come?
And it was kind of late at night, too.
It was after most people's work time.
I promise you got principals racking their brain all over this district right now.
I remember, we were always trying to figure out how can we get more parents.
We need a partnership, to your point.
Not to point, I'm sorry.
But to your point.
Please forgive me.
To your point, I'm just connecting to that.
We need a community.
I think you guys have all recognized that as a need.
What I love about all this is all these are aligning into the monitoring realm.
Like these are all things that if
came to consensus on and focused on could be
like placed in a way to like monitor it and you can see where those things are, right?
And it would be aligned.
Can I add something?
Absolutely.
So when you're talking about that you have kind of a disengaged, we'll say parental
element of that and I think that that's fair to say.
You can go look at, we used to call it latchkey kids.
I was the last key kid.
So I came home, nobody was there.
We'd hang out until my brother got there.
It was a story.
Anyway, the point is when you have that and you say,
well, why aren't mom and dad engaged?
Well, one, is dad around?
Because if dad's not around, you've got a whole list of other problems going on.
So you've got mom alone raising the kids.
To your point, again, I feel like that just makes a circle back to the teacher component
because the teacher is the one that's going to be there I don't like to say
that the teacher takes the role of the parent because that's not their job
that's not why it's yeah when you're with a child for eight and a half hours
out of the day five days out of the week we have to collectively ensure that we
are not just again giving whatever just saying flowery words to caring for them
because they are going to be there at the sundown elementaries at the other
title one schools that we have they are going to be there 99% of their adult
interaction is probably with that teacher so the care of that teacher
directly impacts the kids like that may be the only positive adult interaction
that that child has so we have to make sure that we take care of that one
interactive element so you know flip-flip in so caption kids hearts flip
flip in he's from college station he's an Aggie he coaches football teams like
NFL teams I think one of the I forget the quarterback from UT who went on but
he was his dad used to but anyway he would say it takes one appropriate
adult in a child's life to change your trajectory just one appropriate adult
right and so to your point about teachers I'll put that to say that could
go to the positive or to the negative because you can have one negative
interaction with an adult that could completely derail that child.
It would take four positives to make up for it.
Essentially.
No, for every negative it takes four positives for you to flip it for a kid.
Like every time, and I have to stress that even when I want to strangle my own kids,
I have to say how much damage I want to do.
You know, because I mean it did damage to me.
You know, because you're right.
So there's also the adverse of a disengaged family and like what does that look like?
So if you have those four positive interactions because you have a negative interaction with your with your parent with a person who's raising you
And you need four positive interactions. Well, you would come in contact with more than four adults at your school during the school day
How can we ensure that those interactions are four positive interactions for that one child by making sure that those four
for interactions that they have are well kept teachers
that are supported that in every which way that we can,
even if it takes us at a loss,
that we're ensuring that the next generation
is then cared for because we're caring for those
who are building the base.
And that next generation.
Can you speak to me a little bit more about the loss?
Like so I fully understand that.
If we have to take a loss in terms of like,
I don't know, money?
Money, money's the easy one because it's economics
and so you look at a loss of like what the loss is.
Where do we continue to take a loss
in order to make sure that they have a gain?
So you're actually flipping the conversation
from a deficit thinking to like a receivment, right?
So like I said, an achievement gap,
so like a receivment gap is about
like what we're putting out there for them
instead of like what we're expecting them to achieve.
Right. Okay.
So investment-wise, we're investing into that
and we're saying, yeah, we're taking a little bit
of a loss here possibly financially to put in to get the gain on the other end
of that for the teacher and ultimately for students well yeah because that's
who that's what you want those four positive interactions you have to make
sure that the people that they are interacting with are supported in such a
way that all they're doing again hypothetical is those positive
interactions to that one child maybe but it's more than one we know that if
they're doing it to one they're doing it all does that make sense it makes total
sense to me. I was just thinking, again, this is affirming that spirit of
innovation, but there's a deep sphere for innovation and not always doing things
like within the box because that may not work for the KD today, right? Or the KD
tomorrow for that matter. You know, I always brag about a board that I work
with that's in the coastal region and when they have
conversations about policy it always starts with how will this look in this
community 10 years from now if we adopt this like what will that tenth cohort of
kids look like and that's where they start their conversation and so having
innovative conversations such as this sort of can sprawl you to that type so
we're gonna hear one more and then we're gonna take a break because you guys
been sitting for a really long time are we good with that is everybody still
okay because we're gonna hear from the man the myth the legend himself and yeah
Am I after the break?
No.
Would you like to be after the break?
Just double checking.
I've been waiting for you.
No, right?
No, sorry.
I'm going to do Mary Ellen first and we'll save Ken and Lance.
The last, the leader.
We'll save them for last.
So yes, Mary Ellen, whatever.
Are you comfortable with Ron?
Yeah, he is.
Okay.
No disrespect.
I was just checking.
No, he's good.
We're having fun.
Not being serious there.
I love what Morgan said.
and about we're as strong as our weakest link and we're successful when we take
care of the perimeter the students on the perimeter that don't don't fit in
the high achieving box that Katie is known for but we have a big population
and I would love for the board to monitor just agree on a metric maybe
it's fourth grade literacy or and that we're always looking at that and that it
doesn't get drowned by all the other good statistics. To me the
meaningful numbers are drowned in the success of our district and I'd love if
we're going to continue to innovate or continue to succeed, excuse me, continuous
improvement, right? We're great but we can always improve. We should be looking at
these weak links, decide what metric we're going to watch for those schools. I don't
want any other metrics involved. I want to see it black and white and watch that.
And then critical to that is the teacher link. I want to hear from the frontline. I'm not
here to be to hear from other managers. I already hear that level here. I want to
know from the bottom up. What does that look like to you? We had a teacher retention
committee. Maybe it's a committee with Title I schools. Listening, we talked
about listening circles, I want to hear from the teacher who's working. I want to hear her ideas.
So can you describe for me like the environment of what that looks like so you feel like that
you've achieved a success in what that looks like? Because people, and I'm just saying that out of my
own ignorance, because people, listening circles look very different around the state, right? So
help me. Listening is the key word. Okay. I want to listen to teachers. I never want to be a board
where we're making decisions for the classroom and we're not listening to the
classroom teacher and I want a mechanic report or something that we're always
doing to hear from them maybe it's a yeah like I said whoever did I don't
want to hear from an assistant superintendent I respect them I respect
because sometimes our teachers don't give honesty back right to their
management and I want there to be a pipeline for them to be able to
communicate those things where they feel trusted and safe yes feedback loop so but an authentic
feedback loop yeah right without judgment and and that it doesn't become a complaint fest right we
don't we don't need that either i respect that as well but i want to hear that because we're making
decisions that affect them yeah should be otherwise i'm wasting my time here because i'm not here
necessarily to be a cheerleader i think that's fun and it's good to be positive but i'm here to work
and do something so I hear two things so tell me if I'm wrong so I hear like some
type of Katie agreed metric the board right board right that's a metric
indicator for students right so like whatever that is like was the fourth
grade literacy whatever that market is but you guys agree on students at
campuses that are not succeeding or we don't think you know whatever their C or
your B rating, and it should be an A.
The sundowns, north of I-10.
I don't want the divide anymore to be north of I-10.
We should never be like that.
Yeah, you're ready to lift all boats?
Yes, sir.
Okay, so whatever that metric is
that lifts all boats, right, in Katy,
so that we can really lean into that legacy
that we're talking about.
But there was a second part that was connected
to Morgan and teachers, that was teacher-focused, right?
Amy mentioned it as well. And everyone sort of took it, but Don mentioned it as well.
But please share that teacher piece again with me. I mean I want a mechanic process
where the board receives
bottom-up communication not through an assistant superintendent, any level of management. I want to hear from the teachers.
I don't know how we do that, how we capture that. We did form an ad hoc committee
for teacher retention, maybe it's an AGHA committee for Title I schools for the board
to listen and talk to teachers.
We're directing our superintendent and we should know what they're saying.
May I say something please?
I think, do we still do that full survey?
But okay, yeah, good, good.
So we do a full survey but only 30% are responding.
To me that's not near high enough.
And they don't trust the surveys, that's what I always hear.
So yeah, so I want to keep digging into that though if we can just for a little bit because
I, so surveys are so tricky right? Like they're so, they're so, so very tricky and
I deal with it on a statewide level but I've also been that principal who's dealt
with surveys and my thing is you've always got to have a survey process but
if like people don't feel like it's an authentic process and they, or they feel
like they're gonna be targeted if there's some type of fear or retaliation
then there's no reason and really doing it I don't know that's the case or not
here because that's not my part my part is to like help us like sort of dissect
where is that falling apart and like what can we do to sort of like ensure
that you're getting that because here's the thing all these things are connected
to like teachers and keeping good teachers and Katie great teachers and
Katie and then also like how do we mobilize them to be able to get all the
kids right like lift all the boats that's what i'm hearing you saying so and we're talking about
um we want to hear voice and we want to know that as board members when we're creating policy
that we have the full support of teachers and that we've heard their voices is that have i
encapsulated yes that that piece in there and that there's a mechanism or a indicator that we can
trust it doesn't come from cabinet but comes from it might be a a teacher that has been voted on in
a certain feeder pattern to come and speak or or it could be you know that
it's open that's for you guys to you know figure out but the process of what
the data is and what the components of these whatever however you decide to
collect it is the critical piece yeah has to be calendared and has to be
measured and really looking for it and then always asking the question if it's
quality of day will it be quality tomorrow right especially with like
surveys and and what you're wanting to get out of that so yes that's good
that's great can we improve upon full survey and can we narrow it in on the
sinking ships I don't want to talk about the successful schools they're they're
on course of doing well I want to talk about the ones who need redirection
What can we do for them?
So yeah, so I hear, so let's examine the process of how we collect teacher feedback, right?
And let's make sure that we're building one that's authentic that we can all stand behind because it helps you in the community when you can do that and have that conversation.
But also, like, how are we focusing in on those schools that are not maybe rising to what that Katie standard and what, to Morgan's point, again, I'm sorry, I'm trying not to do that.
I'm doing that because I'm on your team. I'm like, yes!
I'm not offended.
Okay, great. My wife's like, quick, find that people! You're gonna get tased!
Oh, ho!
That's just my, oh God, that's my biggest fear is getting tased.
We live with a metal detector.
Well, I, so, true story, like, it was causing me such anxiety to take my bag,
that I ended the conversation with Ken just to get through it.
I was like, I just need to get this over with.
That's my own PST.
So thank you, Mary Ellen, for that.
I do, again, this is a monitor, and I want to get into that.
So this isn't going away.
We're going to continue.
This is going to continue to guide our conversation.
So I'm getting really, really excited.
It is 630.
Can we do, what do we need, five, ten minutes?
Sure.
Seven.
Okay, we'll come back at 640 and then we'll go to Lansing Gray. Thank y'all so much.
So, 10 minute break here.
Oh, 10 minute break.
Yeah, we'll do 10.
I'll show you.
That's the only thing about this room and where it is, there's not anybody nice,
close
Let's put a microphone behind it.
We're an awesome family.
We're going to put fireballs in there.
Right on.
That may be enough.
Not too long. Go ahead.
Appreciate it. So thank you all.
Hope the break was worth it.
Hope I got to stretch your legs.
Before I get to Lance and then
Ken of course,
I just want to highlight again all the different feedback mechanisms and
appreciate the feedback for sure and it's all around things that can be
monitored so that's really great for calibration as we move forward so mr.
president lands same question was one board action we can take the most
improved student outcomes yes sir I think it's in creating our strategic
design. It kind of encompasses a lot of these things. But on kind of that board
level focus that we continue to see things that were created seven, nine
years ago, what 2014 was when the first one was? 11 years ago? 17? 17, I think. Okay. Yeah.
eight years ago those things come to fruition and and so to see that like as
a board we're able to continue to mold this next phase like what does that look
like you mentioned ten years down the road but what does that look like in two
years and five years in ten years and what new innovations come out of that
that can point back to 2026 when the strategic design was redone.
So what year are we in of it now in this current phase?
We're finishing up year two of the third one.
And so you're saying just the continuous monitoring and I guess engagement with the strategic
design plan that is like the long range that's a long range planning plan for
KDSD right? Yes so in the spring we go for the next round and so continuing to
build that out so as a board we will sit down in January or February and all talk
about what we value that pushes forward and how it creates that plan and then
give that over to say hey these are the steps that need to happen and how it
goes. So the creation and then yes the monitoring.
And there's a continuous improvement part of it as well correct? Element? Yes. I
mean in seeing how just because it was something that was done eight years ago
and it may not actually be one of our goals anymore. It kind of becomes the
culture, becomes the way we do things. So it continues to focus.
And so have I captured it correctly up here? Like strategic plan, like continuous
of that plan, but also systems are monitoring and creating when it needs to
change and through like to continues improvement element yeah so that
involves of course like lots of stakeholders right in that process
because the entire strategic design committee it'll come together a couple
full days comes starts of the board goes to the committee comes back to the board
and so we're involving people kind of all over the place
the community. So essentially you have a plan, right? The plan is aligned with the
goals that produce student outcomes and so just continue to work that plan.
And create the plan. Yeah, create and well I guess you say modify, adapt,
differentiate instruction, right? Like as the student data tells you or indicates
differently you make modifications accordingly. Yeah I mean like this last
session we went we we actually split like physical safety and the mental
health right and so we went from seven to eight so we can create we can rework what
those those goals are. Yeah that's what I'm looking for I'm looking for an
example and then to the other piece that I want to flush out when you're talking
about strategic design and plan. You just made me go somewhere else though. I want to go back to...
You could call it vision casting, you would call it strategy. I mean it's
it's big picture vision for the district about where we're going. And but how
would that look when you talk about agenda items and actions? There are
workshops coming up where it's going to be very much this focus on what are
those things that we want to see measure and then coming out of that would be the
updates we would receive from the district being able to define like hey
these are the what we want to see when we want to see it how it's carried out
so it would be as we move along through that plan that they're like milestone
updates that are brought to us either as items are completed or just hey this is
like for example if it was fourth grade literacy that we were going to choose as
one of those measurements somehow you know what's the cadence that we want to
be updated on that how are we making decisions what maybe defining if we're
hitting those numbers or not hitting those numbers with actions we take if
we're not, but we are. Ken? So I found out sitting next to Lance, he looks on my paper.
You wanted to see what I was writing. Right. But yeah, I just wanted to mess with you.
So a couple of thoughts on that is, yeah, I had put down the part about our goal setting,
and that's our strategic plan that we do. So that's how we set our goals for
the district is through strategic planning and Lance described all that.
So that's a big piece of it. So I'll shift gears and I won't
repeat what Lance stole from me over here. So a few things I've heard
about our academic related on there. Okay we've got an academic committee that
focuses on that maybe that's a focus area we can expand or that we could do
differently there's a lot of data points we we collect as a district and it's a
process that's been going on for years and maybe it's too much maybe it's not
the right data maybe these are things different board members wanted over time
and maybe this board wants different data or whatever maybe that could be
worked through the academic committee so there's a tangible that could go through
through that committee to figure out what data is important for this board to examine
and then focus on that.
You're such a superintendent, we're not looking for solutions or answers, we're just answering
the question.
But I love it because that's what superintendents do, right?
They start thinking about, okay, so you've heard your board say, okay, how can we, like,
I'm listening.
No, I mean, I get it.
Will that impact the student outcomes, how we focus on that?
Yeah, but we're focused on that anyway, but maybe what the district focuses on and looks at isn't what the board is focused and looked at.
And there's a disconnect there. We're going to see something different, but I don't know.
But it could align through that and get to where we need it.
And it could be that they collectively don't know.
Yes.
So, yeah.
But that's the thing. I've worked with boards where they all thought they wanted one thing and then when it got matriculated out and built out, that really wasn't what they were looking for, but they didn't know. They just needed to start somewhere.
Yes.
We may not know what that is because we may be speaking a different language.
Yeah.
Yeah, and we're saying some of the same adjectives and verbs, but like our interpretation or our perspective on what that means is completely different.
And it's hard to know because your background is largely education.
Their background is life in different settings.
But they all have community members coming in, placing all these inputs in them.
And they're trying to also, you know this, they're trying to also process eduspeed,
which is harder to do than one would imagine like a lot of my board makers
struggle a lot would like the edge you speak and the complexity here right and
so and that's the importance to defining really what that is we talked about it
looks different so many different districts but for so many different
people it looks very different so the intentionality behind defining what that
looks like is it worth some time being spent because teacher well-being looks a
lot of different than a lot of things as administrator I would always look at
what other districts are doing and if that was comparable and that was enough
and we're getting away with okay well we're offering the same thing you know
and now I'm like oh I'll check the box I'm moving on to the next thing but like
there could be a deeper something else there that the community may want that
we may not be looking at the right way so like how to but first there has to be
trust established right so we can have that hard conversation because that's a
hard conversation that's I'm gonna involve some emotion and that there
should be emotion because there's kids involved right but how do we control
what we bring into the space in a way that produces productivity but I mean I
love the idea of and the conversation that there's alignment between we have a
strategic plan. This plan has been in place. We've been doing a pretty good job
of producing great outcomes for kids. There's some areas that we need to work
on. We're concerned about our teachers, right, and their well-being and keeping
them happy. Like the medic, the health, you know, the health thing is, I vibe with that.
Like me and Kerry could never be on the same insurance because it costs more. You
You know, so like we're always in different districts, right?
All the kids are always with her, which always frustrated me.
But, I mean, I totally get it and understand.
So thank you guys for that.
We're going to, yes.
So there's a thought about plans.
All right.
I think Mike Tyson said it.
Everybody's got a plan until you get punched in the face.
That's right.
So I think when we look at our strategic design and we say,
that's to me, and I'm sorry,
I know you guys are in the corporate world a lot more than I am.
that sounds like corporate jargon that sounds like corporate okay what does that mean to the
teacher in the classroom that's overwhelmed what does that mean to the parent at home who has their
kid coming home and they're struggling every day what does that actually mean in reality and like
tangible things. So when we say, and you said it, adaptation. Can we see that our
strategic design maybe needs tweaking given the reality that we live in
because strategically and design is a beautiful concept until you implement it
and then you have real people, 96,000 kids and 13,000 employees and the human
element gets in the input into that and how do you then make those adjustments
to actually see that the strategic design through in a way that's good for
the people that it's supposed to be for does that make sense that doesn't make
sense that's what I mean by defining what it is that you're talking about
it's just corporate jargon nothing speak when you say that so make it real like
Those are just flowery language at that point.
Yeah.
Can I have...
I don't disagree with...
No, no, no.
James, hold on just one second.
Oh, sorry.
I want to clarify something.
Yes, I'm going to get to you.
Absolutely, sir.
So just bear with me for a minute because I want to...
So this is...
I understand exactly what you're saying.
Like the edgy speak, the corporate jargon,
like all those things.
We have this wonderful plan,
but what does that really mean to the person
who's actually living and going through it?
because you know, man ain't gonna provide them toilet paper.
Like so this is another one of my mom's things, right?
Like when I used to get upset about people making fun of me or saying something about me,
she was like, they put clothes on your back, they buy food on your table,
they buy toilet paper to wipe your, right?
Like they don't do any of those things, like I don't have nothing to say to them, right?
Some of the things like it doesn't mean something, right?
Like so how do we make this plan something that's adaptive
but also make it something that's real and felt because we know that culture
Trump strategy every time right like you can have the best plan in the world but
when when culture impacts it and that means the interaction between human
beings and procedures and processes you know if they're not if they don't
believe that it's real they don't feel feel like that it's actually something
that they have bought into that they believe that it can stand behind they're
not going to do it. You know, they're just not going to do it. And I
know this not only from working with school boards, but also as a turnaround
principal. Like if I came in and I didn't get the buy-in of my teachers, the one
who had been at war there, then kids were going to suffer, right? So like how do we
make this plan realized and lived so that people feel it at all levels?
Make it tangible, make it adaptive, and see what's great about it is you guys come up with these big ideas.
It's up to Ken and his team to actually figure out how to operationalize that to the way.
But here's the thing, to Jason's point, there's a bridge in what that common language should look like in a board.
and I think that's where there's a lot of misunderstanding, miscommunication, you
know, and just really all up mistrust, you know, because like you're telling me it's
a goat but it's sounding more like a pig kind of thing, you know, and it's and it's
not an attention I think it should just be a language barrier and what these
things mean because like from your side you're like all I hear is corporate so
and correct I don't want to put words in your mouth but it feels like that maybe
you just shut down when you hear the corporate I mean I'm familiar with it
enough to know that there's not a lot of meaning behind it it feels like it's
just we're just saying you're just saying words like you're just saying a
word salad it's just a word salad of nothing and it's like okay can you make
that actually
real so what would that look like let's just use let's use that word also so what would that what
would that look like like what would that look feel like i want to see how this actually impacts
families how is this a tangible thing for a family in this district because what is it what are our
ecodisc numbers they're pretty high right 44. so they how what by what percentage have they gone
on up, let's just say in the last five years since COVID?
20?
I'd say more like 10.
I think 10. I mean, even still,
10 to 12 percent
is a significant amount. And they're not
going down. They're only going up.
So we know that we're
having more families that are going to be
classified as economically disadvantaged,
which means what at the
because this is all about the kids, right? So what
are we seeing that's the same across
the board in economically disadvantaged
disadvantaged families with their kids and how their kids are growing up. How are they succeeding? How are we educating those kids who are going to have different struggles than a family who is not economically disadvantaged?
And then what treatments, like the treatments that we give, like how many kids are impacted? Is that what you're looking for?
How does that strategic design, this corporate jargon, then filter down to the rising economically disadvantaged families that we have in this district to then make that family and those kids and that generation successful in a real time?
How does that help?
Because we have a lot of families that are in this district that are also teachers.
How many of our teachers would be also classified as economically disadvantaged?
So, like, that's crazy.
So how do you take this corporate speaking and make it real?
Go ahead.
Sorry.
Wait, okay, so I love this.
This is great.
So James, Rebecca, and then Don.
So James.
I want to turn, too.
Oh, yes, ma'am.
So to Morgan's point, yeah, so I'm going to say, Ken, you didn't hear any of this stuff, okay?
So yeah, when we started strategic design back in 2017, you're right, that's when it happened.
I was on one of the first focus groups as a campus administrator, right?
And I remember going, yeah, this is good, but similar to what Morgan is saying in the sense of like,
what's it going to look like in real time, in real life?
And it's a similar thing with like a campus improvement plan, right?
Those are encompassing. If you've ever looked at, go look if you've not ever
looked at a campus improvement plan, pages and pages. And I will be honest
with you right here, if you would have come to me and said, hey do your teachers
really know all about your campus improvement plan, what it looks like and
get quoted? I'd be like, no, not even close. They probably knew their grade level and
their subject area expertise, but they didn't know. That was about it.
They didn't go all the way.
Yeah.
Here's my specific goal.
But where I'm going with that is what has to happen is you've got to,
it's kind of like we start with our Constitution of the United States, right?
It's a master document that governs the, well, in this case, our whole country.
Well, to me, the strategic design is kind of that master document.
But if we can't, we have to make laws and rules and regulations and
practices and build culture and all those things because I've heard that for
years too. Culture wins out every time. So what I would say to that is yes the
master plan you can't start without it right like you can't because otherwise
it becomes this piecemeal thing where we don't we don't know. It has to be coherence right?
Yes absolutely and it has to be because that's the piece also that makes us
or moves us toward more consistency so that we are helping all kids. Quick
example, Cinco Ranch when I got there we were about 8% economically
disadvantaged. When I retired we were about 34%. So one in 12 kids to one in
three. That's significant. And guess what we had to do? A lot of different stuff in
those 13 years, right? Like what worked those first couple years and you're
finding out, wait, we're not reaching kids the way we need to. So you take steps and what I did...
I'm already in trouble. Sorry, I'm getting in trouble.
No, you're good. What I... let's see, where was I going with that? Oh, what I was saying is that, you know, as you make those adjustments,
I mean, if I'm going to be 100% honest, I wasn't sitting there going, you know, even
before official strategic design, you know, we had, each superintendent always had these,
you know, specific big, big picture goals.
And so I wasn't sitting there going, oh, my meeting goal, 3.2, Section A, Paragraph B.
you're just like, okay, the kids can't stay after school anymore. We've got to find time during the school day to help these kids who are struggling. How are we going to do that?
Well, you build an advisory period so kids can get help during the school day. That, while that ties back, if I'm sitting here and I can go, oh look, it does tie back, because improvement plan, da da da.
And that's not, I don't think that's most principals and even down to the teachers.
Teachers certainly aren't thinking that way, right?
They're not sitting there going.
They're surviving.
They're surviving.
They are.
They're trying to get through their day.
And as a principal, I've felt like, you mentioned a book that I mention often throughout my career,
is if you don't feed the teachers, they'll eat the kids.
And the idea was, as a principal, that was my job, right?
I'm feeding the teachers. I'm trying to do my best to give them the resources,
the support, the encouragement, whatever that looked like.
And as a board, we're not in the daily grind of it, but in my opinion,
what we do is we're still supporting in the sense of what we show this community we care about.
You're the most important piece of the whole organization.
yeah I mean no no but school boards are the most important piece of the
organization because you guys provide him with the vision of what the sandbox
should look like right right and so and then you authorize the tools for him to
be able to create that in the image of what the community wants for their kids
in the future so that you as a board have to say that that we we recognize
that he's hired to you know oversee that process all the way down to the
classroom in the sense of not that you know we have how many teachers in the
but I'm not I'm not inferring in any way that you should you know know every
every moment of every day in the classroom but what I'm saying is that
when when we're looking at ways to reach kids from our you know the struggling
schools. We know who they are. Don't have to call them out by name. But we
also know that, you know, it's like I would love to be able to say that, you
know, every kid who graduates from Katy will be on grade level with reading and
math skills and stuff. In the same way, I'd love to say that there were no poor
poor people in this country, right?
Like, I wish poverty didn't exist,
but there are so many complicated things going on within a child's life,
things that sometimes we work really hard to overcome,
but sometimes it's too much.
I mean, not that we don't try,
and I would never suggest for a second that we don't pour our hearts into it,
whether it's a teacher, a principal, a superintendent, or a board member.
But what I'm saying is that I guess spending all those years as a teacher and principal, I felt like as long as we are making the honest effort, right, to do the best we can for kids,
then if we can look at ourselves in the mirror and go, you know what, I did everything I could think of to try to help this child.
And sometimes they don't. It's like as a keys mentor. I have a kiddo now, he graduated like, gosh, nine years ago.
And I'd love to tell you, he's CEO of a company. He works at a pet store, scraping by, lives in a low rent apartment.
I wish I could tell you that my mentoring just, you know, it just overcame all this stuff.
And we still have a relationship today. I still see him, you know, every couple months. We'll go have lunch or something.
He still has struggles that were beyond even the school self, right, within his family and everything.
And so I say that to say as much as we love to celebrate, and we do, and we should celebrate the great things, right?
Like, if we don't, shame on us.
But also, I don't disagree with what's been said, too, that, I mean, we have to take a hard look at where we struggle.
But I think, like the academic committee meeting, I think we have one coming up soon, right?
In a week or two, I believe.
You know, to me, I love what you said about, you know, let's look at some of that data and say, where are our biggest struggles?
And then also what are we doing to support them because here's what I know. I know we're doing something
Right. Here's what I here's what I know we're doing. I know we're not going well
You know it's not gonna look at me. No James. Well, uh
They're just failing we tried, you know
There are people that are working at every level you get right
But it starts with that classroom teacher and it has they have to feel like they're supported
all the way all the way through the process right from the team leader and
their team from the department chair from the assistant principal the
principal the assistant superintendent superintendent school board yeah I think
I I think I think I owe you an apology what's that I think I miss said what I
was trying to say like I don't so I'm reading it differently I'm not saying it
like from a perspective that Katie has not done a good job or not done a good job? Oh no no no. Fantastic. I did not, I don't feel that at all. I'm just saying that that we, you know, you, I don't think we forget about those kids that are struggling. I think we're always working on it. You know, can we, can we find better ways to reach kids? Sure. I mean, I don't know them. I don't think one person has the answer to that or two people. It takes, you know, a lot of people working together. But I'm just saying,
it's that we're still willing to do the work and recognize that there are challenges.
And I think most organizations, like when you're in a public place, right?
Like we're not going to go to the celebration at the end of the year and go,
you know, we really struggled in fourth grade literacy this year.
I mean that's not what organizations do, right?
You want to celebrate the wins that you have.
but at the same time as long as we know that those things exist and as long as
we are able to communicate with with our superintendent and we know that that
things are being done and if if if we think there needs to be more or
different things then obviously you know as a board we we have that ability to to
provide feedback to our superintendent but I wouldn't want to make an
assumption that we in those struggling schools that we're not doing you know
all that we can in the sense of like at every level and same thing all the way
to like I'm glad we had those conversations by the way about
insurance I mean I have a daughter that works in this district a son-in-law
I was in this district, insurance was ugh, I hated it.
So I'm glad we were able to have the conversations.
I think too that it matters that the public sees that we care about that kind of thing.
We also, like I learned some stuff, I don't know about it all, I know so little about
insurance, health insurance and how it works and who all is out there and what's really
available and and you know are we are we are we able to provide the best that we
can to our to our teachers the best that's out there for a reasonable cost
I don't you know I don't know that I have the answer that question still yeah
that's not an indictment on our district at all it's just the insurance business
makes a lot of money so I apologize to you again yes because I've not been a
good job of framing so you know the goal is really we're not going to solve any
thing tonight gotcha we're not you see didn't all the
data there we're also not and we're also not if us saying that there's something
that we need to tweak is not an admonishment to the great work that's
already been done we know there's fantastic work being done I think what
I'm hearing and what I'm pushing on some of you is is that yes Katie has done all
these amazing things we're very innovative we do some innovative things
we need to think about doing some innovative things using some of the
same resources and tell me if I'm if I'm not on the right please because I'm
trying to be in tune I am thank you for recognizing myself get
It's true.
But there is an opinion that why don't we pull
those resources and that same innovation
to take care of some other resources in another way, right?
Like teachers, health, safety, mental,
those kids that they're on those outliers
or those boats are not rising.
How can we think, how can we use that innovative spirit?
How can we use that mindset?
How can we use those resources?
I even heard Morgan talk about
even at a loss sometimes to take care of those babies right like how can we
ensure that they're getting and how can we think creatively differently right
and how can we do it because one thing I appreciate that is like this is the
level where those types of conversation I mean I've never been on a board this
you know this right this is the level where we have those types of discussions
right about like how can we kick it up and take it to in my hearing continuous
continuous improvement, innovation for all those areas.
But also metrics.
Oh yeah, for sure.
But metrics that we understand, right?
Yeah.
Metrics that we understand that are not, Amy, I'm just checking in because I want to make
sure that your voice is heard.
If you want to say nothing, it's something you haven't.
No.
Okay.
I'm sorry, I'm just trying to, you know, I know, but I'm going to order.
I didn't know if it was open for everyone.
No, so I'm sorry. I was trying to circle back.
I'm sorry for monopolizing that.
No, you're not.
So this is, you guys, okay, because of Open Meetings Acts and all the things that you have on agendas,
you're limited in where you can have conversations, right?
And even if you don't have to, I don't expect anyone to agree with anything that everybody said today,
but I want you to have a place to be able to say the things because Ken's listening.
Like, he's listening. Lance is listening.
like my hope is that everybody listens and that you again you're just bringing
yourself in the space to be able to say because these things matter because it
was this hey it's not a strategic that's the strategic plan ain't work the paper
is written on if half of you don't believe in it it doesn't matter if
teachers buy into it or not doesn't matter because at the policy making
level which they're supposed to be alignment he don't want to do it if
everybody's not behind it because if he wants to step out and say all my full
board supports everything in this plan like that helps his job be easier right
if he can't fully say that there's no reason and then here's the other thing
you're bringing in all the communities all these people your time and there you
want their input like and so it's important to say if I'm bringing all
these people in I want their data to mean something I don't want them to feel
like they're going to retaliate against I don't want them to be afraid to speak
I want a space to where I can trust the process because then that would help me
get behind the strategic design or whatever that is right I know Lance
doesn't want to be leading a plan that everybody's not into so like if it's not
right now like what steps can we can take to try to get there because we know
that any success moves at the speed of trust right and so that's what we're
just taking very simple steps to just break down so we get understanding so
it's important for you to have that expanded conversation so thank you for
that and now moving on to madam director so many thoughts in my head but let me
just go to strategic design as as the mumbo-jumbo piece that strict design
design Morgan what you call it corporate salad corporate word salad so when I
mean one of the things I had written down as well and when you have president
and the superintendent talking about what was the question was name a board
action that would improve student outcomes and you can't have a school
district this size without a strategic design right in a plan and this board
board, with the exception of Mr. Cross, modified it twice. Did we spend two meetings? We spent
two meetings modifying it piece by piece by piece by piece. And so that word salad was
built by us. And we spent lots of time word, you know, choosing the word that we wanted.
This word instead of that one. And we had papers all over the room. You all remember
that we weren't all part of that but yes yeah that didn't happen but just what
just but I am asking we together as a board and then the community did that as
well that's what I heard a lot of splicing of words yes but even even I
remember having it around the board with with our former president and weighing
in on on as y'all were brand new I believe it was your first so we
We received it. We being the three of us, brand new ones. It's quite new to receive that sandbox.
Already created.
Right, and then modified it. And then gave input and modified it.
Took us two meetings. So we built it together.
And then we sent it to the community.
I mean, we did a lot of modifying.
Mrs. Cuzela, do you remember?
I'll probably disagree with a lot, but that's okay.
But if I may interrupt here, I think it's so everybody's on a different learning journal as they onboard as a trustee.
And it's not going to look.
I mean, it's not going to look.
I know, but I was just trying to get agreement.
No, I get you.
But my point is, I understand.
I just need you to bear with me just for a little bit.
just hold on just for a second because what I'm gonna what I'm saying is to you
is that regardless of what on around they were with this strategic design
like it wasn't done in a way to the way they felt it was meaningful and and and
something they could buy into is that yes but I wouldn't insinuate we have a
learning challenge or what behind no I'm not and I don't mean that as a
a fisherman. I mean like... He's insulting all of us. No, not trying. This is the way I look at life. Like when my parents brought me a bike, I didn't hop on it and just take down the road. Like I had to take time to learn like how to pedal, like how to, and same thing with swimming. You know, and even when I got on the Texas School Safety Center board, I was very frustrated initially because I was a principal. I was used to things being happening and Jason would be like, no, board work doesn't work like that.
this you need to sit down somewhere i get mad because it was like we've been talking about
this for three years like what's a ham sandwich and i didn't understand that everything churned
with the legislative cycle and once i understood that then i was a better board member so i'm not
talking about it in a negative sense i'm just talking about it in just understanding the process
piece it would have took me two or three years to honestly like just once again it's all it's all
there's a lot of there's a lot of pieces there yeah i mean and so i'm not questioning anybody's
intelligence even just to be a policy makers at a certain level I was just
trying to stamp the idea just the idea that you can go to all the meetings you
can be a part of all the processes but if if you weren't brought in on
inception then your understanding of it and the meaning of it may not align with
with where you are, right?
Or where the culture is.
Or the people who just selected you.
Or the people.
Where the culture adapts, right?
So culture is ever changing.
So as we've seen in the last few years,
culture has greatly shifted.
And so does that always align with where the culture is then?
And at the same time, you can't have a back and forth.
Like you can't give your district whiplash
just because of a changing culture
in that kind of immediate, right?
You have to be able to read the room.
you have to have some discernment there and say okay long-term planning is this
a good thing for us which is what that strategic design is supposed to do I
understand the concept of the strategic design that's not what I'm taking apart
that's not it it's kind of what you alluded to are we making that before are
we making that real down to the level of the people that actually want to impact
I can continue what I was saying okay yes ma'am so and thank you for the grace
I appreciate that we build it we send it to community for their input and buy-in
we vote on it and then it is broken down into so many pieces and pieces and
pieces that it gets to the teacher or a or the community there are so many
pieces of that right we have a community-based piece we have all the
things and everything has people at the district in charge of it to make sure
that it's monitored it has actionable steps it has timeframes that there's
smart goals attached to every single one and then there are people and processes
attached to make sure that every one of them is carried out and then we get
reports to support continually about how that's happening so how does the teacher
know there's an instructional coach who shows up and helps disaggregate data so
that she can reach every student to the best of her and the students abilities
those things that are happening that cause KTISD to be more successful than
any other district in size in Texas is because of a strategic design with
with actionable steps and people, brilliant people,
saying this is the best way to do it,
get our approval on it,
and then deliver it to the classroom.
So a teacher might not know, a parent might not know,
this is goal six, step three, year two,
sub-step this because someone comes in.
But that's what we have enacted,
which is making us successful with student outcomes,
And that's why both Lance and the superintendent had it as their number one reason that we
could improve student outcomes.
And we know it because we get the measurable action out of some of that.
It's why James knows how it happens and his teachers don't know that it's happening, but
he knows now we can't do this, we're going to add in the advisory period because we're
still going to reach kids.
So we change with that.
So this strategic design might not be something that people understand what it
is, but it's critical to the success we've had. And I think it's a very good
tool for why we can improve student outcomes. Because it's constantly changing,
like you said, with culture and with other things. Not, it doesn't turn on a dime or
too big a shift to turn quickly, but that's, I believe that's why it's very
successful. I don't disagree with changing the student outcomes and looking at
focusing on really honing in on that student outcome piece of that. I don't
disagree with that. The part where I kind of branch away is I'm not as concerned
about the B rated school that was an A rated school last year because the state
does you know funny things in News Gold Post or whatever you want to say and now
they're a B rated school. I'm more concerned about the C rated school
that's now a D rated school or the D rated school that is on the fence of
becoming something else. I'm more concerned about the B rated school that's now, I'm more concerned
about those because I know that that is where we've got a large gap, that we've got a lot of
space to make up, right? Like that's where we have a loss here. So the A to B is significant,
it matters, I'm not saying it doesn't, I'm just looking at it from a different perspective of
saying okay what about those that are like really down the list that's wildly
concerning me I'm not saying we shouldn't celebrate the successes I'm
not saying that at all I'm not trying to say that we don't that's not what that's
not what I mean but what I mean is a lot of those successes oftentimes celebrate
within themselves just at the idea of these large successes it is celebratory
in nature because they succeed at such a high level.
Are we still doing that success celebration on the lower level?
Yes, it's actually your turn.
Okay, so first of all, I do think that we celebrate successes at the lower level.
I mean, I witnessed it all the time.
I taught, I think, 20 JA classes at Rhodes Elementary the first year.
And, you know, that's an underperforming, you know, I hate to call it underperforming,
but it's not as well performing as some other schools.
Let's put it that way.
But, you know, every day those little kids are rewarded with something.
You know, like, oh, you turned in your homework.
Here's a sticker.
You know, there are tiny little celebrations all along the way,
even with the child who might be failing.
You know what I mean?
And I see these teachers just consistently trying to build up these kids
and do what they can. But back to the big strategic plan thing, I agreed that when I was new that was a brand new thing that had just happened the year before.
And I didn't know anything. Like they were showing me this with all the, you know, year one, year two. I'm like, what? It was so big to me.
But James really kind of explained it really well. That, you know, we have the US Constitution,
we have the Texas Constitution, we have these big, and I don't have those things memorized
word for word, but I know I'm doing, I'm probably, I am like abiding by the laws, you know what
I mean? Because the laws are just then broken down to what, you know, oh I can't go over
35 miles per hour on that street. It's really what I'm concerned about right now, you know,
while I'm driving or something, or there's a stop sign, I better stop at it.
And the only other thing I'd like to say is that as a mom or a parent,
I'll just use me as a mom, when my child went to kindergarten for the first time a long time ago,
there probably was a plan, you know, Dr. Fraley or whoever,
Leonard Merrill, whoever was the superintendent, probably had a big plan.
But all I knew was on Wednesday, Connor had a spelling test.
You know, so the mom, the parents, is doing these little incremental things,
which is meeting Dr. Merrill's bigger goal. And I'm completely unaware of it because I just want my son to do this on the same spelling test.
You know what I mean? I want him to know his hundred words by the end of kindergarten or, you know, or not get on, we used to do the color check.
He was always on the bad color. He could just have one day of good color, that was a good day for me.
But, you know, so small little incremental things that we don't need to know what those big things are.
I had no idea that we even had a good plan at all until 2018.
And two of my kids already graduated.
And guess what? They were following some kind of plan I didn't even know about.
But they graduated and they went to college, you know?
I didn't even know what that 30 page thing was.
I knew other, when I got on the board I realized other people were worrying about that.
And it worked out good for my kids, you know?
But all I was caring about is, can Brenda play tennis next week or something?
You know what I mean? I didn't know.
But there was some kind of bigger plan that Brenda was spitting into.
I had no idea that.
Can I ask a question?
When did we switch from our huge population growth?
At what year did we see the massive population growth really start to spike in KDISD?
Do you know?
Help me define what would you say is huge population growth.
Right now we're at 96,000 kids, right?
So we didn't get there overnight, and we haven't been there for a sustained –
we haven't been there for 10 years, right?
But are we going back like 10 years to where we see that that growth that 20 decline or that increase?
I'm sorry, the increase of the decline.
Yeah, Rebecca may know because she's been here longer and I have to really know what that growth number looks like.
We opened six schools one year, four elementaries, a junior high and high school. We were growing 3,500 kids a year in the
2005
2015
2015 when did we do that? But it has it has ebbed and flowed. Yes. PASA will do a high, mid, and a low.
And sometimes during that course of history before I got here we were really
high like Rebecca's explained it. Then we started using the mid model and then we
switched to the low. So Janet pulled up here with a question. She wanted to know when there was a huge increase?
So like in 2014, 2015, 10 years ago, we were at 70,600 kids.
Okay.
So we've grown 25,000 kids in 10 years, which if you do that over a figure over 70, what is that, like 40%?
So we've had like a 40% growth in the last 10 years.
That's a pretty drastic rate.
We were at 3,000, 3,500 for a while, now we're around 2,000.
We've had years where we've added 5,000 kids. We've had years where we've added 1,000 kids.
But again, if you look over the last 10 years, we've had over 25,000 kids.
So I ask that question because it's a pretty drastic amount of kids and community growth and just overall growth as we see it.
And so when I use the corporate jargon word, those aren't exactly just my words.
Those are words that were given to me from one of our long-term principals at one of our legacy schools,
talking about how we're losing the community aspect and we're becoming more corporate.
So that's kind of alarming to me. When you think corporate, you think cold, you think disengaged, not attached,
unfeeling kind of just regular moving through just straight to the top no matter what the people don't
matter at the bottom that's what you think of when you think of corporate so an administrator feels
like that we're losing a community part of that that Katie has been known for for a really really
long time and we're now becoming more corporate in our language and in the way that we treat our
staff I'm not saying that you guys I'm not saying anybody's treating our staff
like that I'm just saying it that the perception that's a problem that's a
problem even into the classroom that's a problem what did you say to that
principal and they said that I said it's very difficult to do with 96,000 kids
and 13,000 employees and that I am concerned about it as well that's what I
told them which is my honest opinion I was just curious behind the five years
I would like to know what to say to you.
I would say I'm concerned of that as well.
That we're losing the community aspect of that.
Which is why, and I told her this, is why I say the things that I do.
Because I'm concerned about it.
And I've been concerned about it for a while.
Well, because you know the difference because you grew up here.
Right, and I do too.
I know Lance has been here just longer than I have.
You're older than I am.
But I know what Katie was.
I don't mean that disrespectfully.
Yeah, I know.
I mean, but you know, I grew up here so I know what the community aspect is.
I know where we started from and I know what this looks like and it looks drastically different and not always in good ways.
So how do we retain what the good is
without losing our soul to the corporate structure?
Hold on, I do because I want to honor something. It's 731.
one. Yeah, we've gone through it. There is one other piece I would like to
explore if you guys would give the time and grace for that. I mean because I
think so I think it's been really productive. I think one of the things I
know is strategic plan is great, right? But we need to tweak and we need to make
it more humanized and more personable and maybe look at some of our language
and then look at some of our targets and then talk about like how are we
protecting our teachers taking care of them and see how that's addressed like
and those are conversations all we had I didn't hear any one person say that
strategic planning is bad right but like how can we all lean into it and support
it fully as a board because regardless of you know and I'm going through this
on my own personal team here at TASB I took over a division where three of my
people have been there since 1985 they literally graduated from law school and
they've been there and they all apply for my job right and I'm very different I
have a huge different approach but you know there's lots of other cover
sessions there but I say that to say I've hired a third party team to come in
and sit down with us and do real team building because I need my team because
I'm going into your three and I've got seven thousand school board members who
are counting on me to make sure that they're getting great training that
focus on so I'm going through this whole and I have a strategic plan but it's my
strategic plan it's not their strategic plan because I put something together
out of compliance you know but they're not bought into it so I can move around
I can do all the things but it's still not truly being lived amongst my team
and as a leader I need to make sure that's happening and and so I'm telling
you I'm in that struggle too that's why I told you I can't teach you nothing
which is you get to facilitate but if you guys would be willing I would like
to go through one more exercise and then we'll stop there are we good can I make
one comment you sure can short and sweet absolutely so with the growth of our
district that I love it burned from ten years ago these seven board members
represent a whole lot more people. Our voice is always important. We're at the
top of this org chart and we need to be respected and listened to as a
representative of the people that we represent. And we represent a whole lot
more people in 2025. We have 240,000 constituents that we represent. So it's
very very important that we listen to our input at the top when we're creating
this strategic design that then trickles down to the teacher and the taxpayer and
the parent and we're trying to make it tangible if we've not listened to the
board whom the people elected who pay into this district that's that's off the
get-go we have a problem yeah we want them to keep paying the district as well
I'm going to ask, may I please ask a question on Ms. Cuzela?
Yes.
Because I remember, now I'm remembering that, that one of the things that you, I think,
expressed, and maybe others did too, but I know that one of the opinions expressed was
that what you just said is what you said before, that that really, you didn't, maybe I misunderstood,
but you really didn't want the community to be able to slice and dice it as much as they did after we had made the decisions that we made.
Incorrect.
Okay, so I'm sorry, I got that wrong.
I don't know where you got that from.
But what was it that you were feeling like?
Oh, so I'll explain myself.
Okay, great.
So I was just elected, along with these two ladies.
We come in and we're plopped down, kind of what you said with your team, we're given
a strategic design that all of a sudden I need to steer with, but I had no input on.
Right? So that's a problem and that needs to be worked on. I think we tried and I
communicated that. Right? So it's just very important that we are representing
the people that elected us. I take it extremely important. So you wanted to
start from ground zero? That was an option.
That was an option.
I don't think that's what...
That was an option.
I just...
Are you...
Do you not like that idea?
No, I'm not saying I like or don't not like or whatever, but I'm just...
I really am honestly trying to understand.
Did you want to start from like a blank piece of paper and just start with a brand new strategic
plan that we would develop as a board?
Okay, I think we're...
Yeah.
We've destroyed it because I'm...
but what I would like to insert is I think this goes along so Lance and I
Jason have been having conversations about and one of the things that he
really wants is is sort of like to your point how are we onboarding incoming
trustees in a way today feel like that they're a part of the process right like
you know he's we've been discussing this like for long-term success because we
know for long-term success for the district right and to support and and
that's his thing like you know and even his experience because he's gone through
different integrations of different boards and from his onboarding for a
percent but even the onboarding from his experience and leadership task being and
then what you're saying right like he knows that and Jason knows this like
when you go to the HEB Board of Excellence Award they're going to be
checking to see is everybody on board with the strategic plan you know like
they have a committee of board members that come in they're going to ask you
And so it's going to be, you know, what we don't want, because let's just be honest, you guys apply, like you're going to get finalists just like on anything just because of the gravitas that you carry around the state, like, and accomplishments and all things you do with kids.
Where the rubber meets the road is in those interview sessions.
And you said this previously, like, if you don't, if you're a finalist and you don't get chosen, then likelihood of you getting that cycle again is far and few between, right?
And so he's like, so how can we have conversations, to your point, about onboarding all my board members and getting feedback in a way to where it does meet what the community really truly values and wants?
Did I misspeak there?
No, and I would add one of the most powerful tools we have is a strategic design.
I mean, our literacy curriculum that directly affects fourth grade reading levels was changed because we laid out this is what the board wants to have happen.
And then we also were able to change that because working with the district, I came back and like, that's a really short-sighted because I think we originally wrote the district or the our goal was select a new curriculum.
When in reality, what it needed to be was a new literacy framework, which was wasn't was was independent of a curriculum.
How are we going to teach? Let's make those decisions and communicate that.
And then that would trickle down to a curriculum.
And so I think like a part of break out that answer more is the things that we want to accomplish if those are our strategic goals.
And I get that they're like big level. I don't like the name strategic design. We could just call them goals.
You know, action items if we wanted to. But I do think they are high level things.
I mean it's it's why do we continue to create more CCMR type other
certifications and stuff is because that's been a goal that's been put out
there to say we want to keep adding to these things like our water treatment
thing is continuing to carry that out why why did we try to ramp up listening
to people more enough people more one of our goals was to expand our advocacy
Yeah, but well, coming out of this three years ago, our entire board said we're not good at interacting with the community and we're not doing advocacy.
And so we said that's a goal.
And part of the thing through that was going through the trustee advocacy program, which led to listening circles, which has led to more engagement on a state level.
And so I do think there are some of those things that are focused at a higher level.
What I'm hearing is are we able as a board to drive some of those things almost like
a back to the basics, like how are we setting some of those strategic goals that are impacting
the classroom?
And even how many kids are being impacted, right?
Like what's the yield radius of this resource and its impact?
You know?
Yeah.
Great.
All right.
We're going to move on.
Thank you for the grace there.
We're going to move on to this next.
I'm actually going to skip around based on our conversation and talk about
psychological safety. I think that's important to this work. So psychological
safety and trust. It's important and tonight is I think it's great evidence
that's important for us to ask, feel safe to ask really hard questions to learn
faster and better execute because when you guys don't execute kids lose so you
know regardless of how the design is set up you guys are only one vote
collectively but when you don't make those decisions kids lose and so my
question is again we're in the same exercise and I really am going to lean
on you guys to self monitor and make sure that you're only talking about
yourself and then to others who are listening and absorbing don't react and
also don't think it's directed at you because this is going to be a really
this is probably going to be the hardest part of the evening okay because I'm
shifting something around here but I think we need to get there to be able to
do the future work and we're not I'm going to try this I'm not well I don't
know I might drop it up there we'll see we'll see how what's what's it but this
is critically important to the work and it's also critically important to the
work around even being able to express what we are with the strategic plan. That's a
hard thing to admit. Like everybody wants to be on board. Nobody, like I used to say
this about my teachers, no teacher comes to school and says I want to suck at my job.
Right? Like I just don't believe that. They come in there but they've just been
beat down. Right? Like they're just that one last thing or there's so many, I mean
for me it was the 530 calls. How many subs I'm going to have today? Right? Like I
I didn't need an alarm as a principal.
I knew that 5.30 call was the last time
they could call in for a sub,
and so I was automatically up,
because I gotta figure out who's gotta cover what.
But for us, for all intents and purposes,
it's important that you guys
have a place of psychological safety
so that you can have the hard conversations
and still move the decision along.
So here's the prompt.
When have we felt most safe to disagree here?
Okay, so when have we most felt safe in your meetings to disagree? What made that possible?
And Amy, I'm going to start with you whenever you're ready.
When have you felt the most safe to disagree and what systems were in place to make that possible?
I would say never.
What's your board?
with the board. Not often, really. Not often either? But I would say mostly I feel safe out in the public. But not behind closed doors.
James? Gosh, I'm newer to the group. Yeah, I don't know. I can't think of a...
Yes or no, you feel safe having conversations? Oh, no, I wouldn't say I feel safe.
I have to ask you that to get your I like I like direct that's good director
Fox psychologically safe this is the question yes ma'am I feel safe I've done
this a very long time I'm very committed to the purpose in which God has brought
me here I feel safe expressing my views because I know where my heart and where
my focus is and I and I I know people disagree with me but I know my my
purpose and my focus and and also know that it will probably understand that it
will be contradicted or taken in a way that it was not intended to make me
misrepresented. So there's a spirit of resiliency from just your tenure and
knowing just the role and the stature in the community and all those like you
just become really battle-tested because... An experience, experience and for every
person as they serve longer understands that and probably feels it and
And I think it was Lance that said this one time.
He said, what was it, Dr. Wong?
Someone said, success is not an accident.
So KDICD didn't become what it is by accident.
And so while there have been many mistakes
and many things I would do differently,
we got here because of seven people constantly around this board
who care more about about babies being successful and working together even
when they disagree I've worked with 30 board members and four superintendents I
didn't agree with all of them at all times and yet we could when you stay
focused on student outcomes it's it's it's a miracle magical per miracle I
think what's the guy with the blueberry ice cream Jamie Vollmer said there are
miracles that happen in campuses every day and being on a campus I see them and
I'm grateful for them and it's what brings me to this table year after year
after year. Thank you for that and thank you for your many wonderful years of
service that's a lot that's great. And losing is not easy I lost I was invited
to take a break by my community winner. And I thought I was finished and then God called me back.
So was Jason.
I love it enough to put up with those kinds of things said about me. If I were thin-skinned, I wouldn't be here because
many people are the disrespect can be great but purpose comes it thank you I always feel
pretty confident so I don't know if that's safety I'm not afraid to share what I think
the questions a little odd for me so I'm not sure save to disagree yeah just felt more so
It's just around psychological safety and just establishing.
No problem telling you what I think, but I do not know, or I'm not confident in how that leads the boardroom.
And how it's twisted and manipulated and communicated.
I don't feel that.
Okay.
So, that's a shame.
That's actually really great clarification there, right?
So, like, yes, I am confident in my space, and I'm confident in what I'm saying at the moment.
my concern is again this goes back to trust trust of how that's going to be
regurgitated or reverberated or osmosis or however gets out right and then what
that depending on the scope and slant to it what and so that's the concern for
the safety piece right so does that hinder so much so then a follow-up
I'll ask you this as well, Director Fox, is, does that create a little bit of angst?
I see him pointing again. Does it create a little bit of angst about, do you hesitate
about, or do you go home and you're like, man I should have said that, but oh, it probably got me.
I do not hold back.
You don't, okay. So you don't have that issue.
I'm just disappointed if it's not taken seriously or it's not seen as constructive.
Not taken seriously.
Talk a little bit more about what that looks like.
Well, I'm not here to waste time.
I'm not here to blow smoke and I'm not here to direct a ship that's in cruise control.
I'm here to steer an organization with this board and to work.
And so I don't know, I'm not, like I said, I take it seriously who I represent and what I'm here for.
So I'm going to say whatever I think needs to happen.
Do you enjoy it when you say an opinion and then you're interrogated by it?
True, yeah, I mean there's been times when we are in-
I mean asking you to clarify one time is reasonable.
Sure.
But over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again is abusive.
Yeah.
There needs to be better respect when we may disagree.
I agree with that.
And I think there are systems in place.
We have something called a closed session.
I'm a rule follower generally, particularly when I'm in a legal role.
And the closed session means it's closed.
So if everyone abides by that, it's probably going to be a lot better.
So I'll say that. That's the system.
I would agree. There is, you know, there's a lot of people who we always find, we do our best work when it's in closed session, right?
Because that's where a lot of, but there also has to be that exchange that, you know, what's they, you know, loose lips sink ships.
There's lots of you guys need a space to have conversations. So but this leads exactly to what we're building to so I appreciate
that and then Rebecca do you feel any type of because
Yes, you you have to continue to have the experience you have the battle tested mentality and a fortitude
But are there times to where when you're reflecting you're like, oh, I don't want to say that because it would be twisted or they'll come
come out and say this or do you all the time I constantly think about what I'm
what I'm going to say and it's almost always a what I hope it is it's a
clarification of why we do what we do the historical perspective of how we got
here, not that it has to be that way. I don't say that we've always done it that way, keep
doing it that way. That's not, I never believed that. But how we got here had a purpose and
a reason and those kinds of things, yes, and I get defensive of KDISD.
Yeah, because you're part of the work.
Part of the work, and I, but the people, the brilliance of KDISD that built it. I'm very
defensive but I don't always say everything I want to because I'm not I'm
trying to make a point or clarify something but I'm another system item
in place as a president who is in control of the board sorry in his seat I
I have a seat too and everyone else, but that he's managing the discussion correctly as well and stays on topic.
And is facilitating the meeting appropriately.
So that I'm hearing you correctly.
I'm not saying it's an issue.
I'm just saying that it's an important system.
It's an expectation is what I hear you saying.
Would that be an expectation?
Is that what you're saying?
Yes.
like so it is expectation to help protect that psychological safety in a
space where our opinions can be given without interruption without accusation
that's key or just an ask to explain but then once the explanation is given we
move on but instead it's just constant no I don't agree you're wrong say it
again say it again say it again and that's abusive and it's not productive
Yeah, so it's, we're not having enough time Lance, but we'll get to that. Interesting that you say that because we did an analysis, my planning and research team did an analysis. We looked at all of your school board meetings online and your work sessions and we did an average of how much time is spent on having discussions around student outcomes and how much time is spent on adult driven conversations.
And so we'll go to that on the slide deck here after we hear from Morgan about psychological. So the question is, when have we felt most safe to disagree here and what made that possible?
I feel safe to disagree with anyone, anywhere, at any time.
I was born that way.
I don't shy away from it.
I never have, I never will.
God gave me a fire that, as much as people would like to,
is never going to be extinguished until the day that I take my last breath.
So I have no problem disagreeing and saying what I believe in with conviction.
I feel completely safe to do so.
And I'm happy to defend it at every opportunity that I have.
So, my psychological well-being is fine.
I go to bed at night just fine, unless the perimenopause comes and wakes me up with hot flashes.
There's nothing I can do about that.
But other than that, no, I sleep just fine at night.
And I'm totally okay. I feel safe.
Yeah, so I'm sorry I just had a personal issue because my wife is going through that and she feels like it's men's fault that I don't understand that because the medical industry has worked against women.
It's very fascist.
Yeah, and she goes...
I'm sorry, not fascist, it's very men's fault.
Yeah, and she's blamed that and then my daughter just has been blessed here recently so I have
Like so me and my son just go and sit on the patio some days for the reason
To let them and I don't say a word and how you know, I'm freezing one moment. I wake up. I'm hot. I don't
You know just so but I
applaud that but so you don't have any of those instances of
Like Rebecca she was talking about where she's like man
I wish I would have said that like that's not on your radar or anything or
No.
It's just...
People are going to take it however they want to take it.
That's not my issue.
I can't control how you...
I can't control your perception.
I have no control over that.
So I don't...
Is your mission driven focus?
Yeah, this is my job.
So my job is not to sit up here and rubber stamp anything.
My job is not to put rose colored glasses on and pretend like some things aren't happening.
It's not my job.
And if that was my job, I wouldn't be interested and I wouldn't have applied through running
for office.
This was not a popularity contest for me.
I mean, kind of, you win the popular vote, whatever.
But this was not prompting.
That wasn't your motivation?
I wasn't running for prompt queen.
That was not what I was doing.
And I did it with intention and with focus and with God leading me through that.
So I have no problem with what I do at all.
and so I can't control how people perceive that.
So I feel good.
I feel good.
Very good.
Yep.
May I have a clarifying?
statement can you i'm going to get through ken and ken and lance and then yes of course um because
they keep talking about being scared so i'm not scared to say what i want to say that's that is
but you you have psychological well-being which the question is when have we felt most safe to
disagree right but that has nothing to do with being scared i keep hearing that word i'm not
scared to say anything you know but I never said I was scared to say anything
but psychologically safe maybe not yeah and your response was not often I'm not
scared I'm not scared either but I don't yeah but that doesn't mean that I mean
I'm okay if people will disagree with me but it's like when I disagree with other
people it just it's kind of really scared but I'm gonna tell you you all
have family members that you love dearly in your life you all have them that when
Thanksgiving comes around and Christmas comes around sometimes you decide how
far you want to push your conversation and how far you don't and so if you have
any doubt of that's happening then it impacts kids that's what I'm trying to
get you to understand like if there's not a free space where you can have the
conversations like when Jason I facilitate leadership TASB, let's
continue this there because we get in arguments because we disagree with how
we're going to facilitate an our own discussion because we care so
passionately about the work right like he'd walk out there and what's wrong
with you know because he thinks we should do it one way I think something
different you know and we're upset because we care about the work because
we know the impact right but we have to be safe and then the other day we're
fine right but we've learned through the years how to like have those discussion
I don't agree with everything he doesn't agree with everything I do right but we
have a mutual respect for what we bring and there's been time I mean even
discussing this we didn't agree and we had to redo the plan because you're like
I don't think we should go that way right um even as much as this morning
about the direction and the plan and and it took us years to get there right but
the value and the benefit on the back end for kids you all have tremendous
heart for kids and teachers like that's evident it's very very clear like each
one of you guys I have no doubt leaving here that each of you are not here for
the right reason in the right way it's just what can we come to agreement on as
as a board and then what can we all buy into
because Lance does not, he's told me this,
he's like Robert, my fear is that I'm running a mile
and I turn behind me, everybody's like,
oh look, there's board president running,
look there's board president,
but they're not saying that's, they're the board running.
No one's following him.
Yeah, nobody's following him.
He's like I don't wanna hear the president's running,
I wanna hear, there's the whole board.
And he goes, and even some of us are running
a little slower than others, we're all running together.
Right?
right and so how do we start that process right and so the vision of
tonight wasn't to critique or judge or pick apart it was just like where can we
start the conversation and so we started a conversation two ways one is we talked
about student outcomes and I'm going to share this that if you want to see this
I do want to get Lance. I'm getting ahead of myself. And I want to get Ken too.
I feel safe, but I would agree with Mary Ellen and Rebecca.
And sometimes you're like...
Afterwards.
Yeah, afterwards.
After the discussion, what's it going to turn into? Getting out of all the groups on social media helped a lot though.
Like for psychological safety, you want to get out of those groups. It makes life a lot easier.
Yeah, Space Book wins every time. My aunt in Livingston, y'all heard, if y'all know me, y'all heard me talk about Aunt Annie Faye. She knows everything about Space Book.
What's her name?
Aunt Annie Faye.
Okay, I'll write that down.
She has a son named Zeke. He's really wild. He probably is too big to be on horses, but that's a whole other problem.
That's hilarious.
I mean, it's the truth, though. You can go see this.
Why?
I'm not a life.
I told him to call the SPCA.
He's a good one.
I really am. It's East Texas, y'all.
But Lance, I have a follow-up question
to that because you've experienced
that piece, but there's also
the expectation around
the President's role in
setting that psychological
safety
piece. Have you thought about that or is that
part of the process for when we're
looking at like how we onboard new trustees and then what that looks like
for your board operating procedures or what are your thoughts? I mean, something
about like what Mary Ellen mentioned, there's a part of it like we're at the
dais having a conversation and you want to assume positive intent when I mean
like if James starts talking to Amy and starts saying, he starts into a question
and you've got to assume that it's going to add value to the conversation, right?
And so, like, talking about, like, when do you shut it down?
Like, there's got to be, I feel like everybody in here deserves the respect
to be able to start the conversation until it's to the point where, like,
if it gets to the point I just disagree with it, I'm like, ooh, I wouldn't go there,
but I know there's lots of places I wouldn't go that people choose to go.
and so I mean obviously there are times to gavel it out but I feel like there's
a self there has to be a self-regulate part that we agreed so you have an
expectation that them being trustees elected trustees that they should
self-regulate as professional so that's the expectation right but then there's
another part of your team that is saying though I really need your help with this
well behind closed doors it's very different I always tell people they're
like do you what's the boardroom like what is that like like it looks like a
corporate boardroom when you walk in but really you're walking into a gladiator
arena it's not there's just gladiator with suits
That's what it is. It's backstabbing, it's cutting you out at your ankles, it's taking
gunshots, it's nasty, it's political, it's dirty. You better have a real thick skin if
you're going to do this game.
So am I hearing that there might be an appetite or a conversation for the President setting
expectations in both open but also in that closed session?
Yeah, I've asked for it.
okay what we get to codify tonight so Lance is receiving this discuss so thank
you for that I would like to say that Lance has done a good job of like we're
discussing item dot dot dot and redirect us in a way that I haven't seen before
so I yeah well it's fine to ask questions and ask any board member why
they feel the way they feel that's totally reasonable I think that's
helpful it does help our kids to have an understanding of where everyone's coming
from but to ask it hundreds and hundreds of times over and over and over again
just because you don't agree is not that is abusive and it's wrong and it's not
it hurts our kids yes yeah we're ready for you Ken yeah and thank you Ken for
being here and supporting you know you bet you bet it's important it's
important. A team of eight is important. So yeah sure I feel safe you know I mean I
can express my opinions and my expertise on just about any topic when it comes to
education. I think the second part of your question is probably more valuable
we haven't spent really time on that and I'm not asking to but I mean what
systems are in place that make that possible? Very few right now but if we
can come to an understanding. And that's not your work. Yeah yeah. By the way I want to
to make that clear that is not the superintendent's work like yeah super
tenants just stay away from any type of award operating procedures for a board
that is board and there are boards who like all of us know you don't like no
you're not put superintendents in that place so I appreciate you saying that
yeah so I mean it's it's part of you mean safe and in community it's part of
communication yeah I mean and you're having open dialogue and and what I've
found which has been helpful in my experience of working with people
especially working through conflict is you've got to go into a conversation
with the mindset that the other person has something that may be of value to be
heard and if we can go into conversations that way I think that
would provide that system that you're talking about possibly your GT so here
Here is our suggestion for this as we get ready to close the evening.
Like, you know, I would challenge you to decide on three micro-behaviors, right?
Moving forward.
One being, like, an example is one question before a claim.
Because, so, we watched all of you.
So, I always watch board meetings, but Katie's, I'm always going to watch board,
but I really have watched all your board meetings.
Well, I mean it's important. What I found is that there's always a claim before
there's a question, right? Like there's a claim like asserted at someone, right?
Sometimes it's in the form of a question, but there's a claim. So before that, ask a question before one claim.
And then have a conversation about rotating who answered or who opens with a learning question might be something to consider to help rebuild that psychological safety.
to just put some constraints on that as a team as you try to establish because
regardless if if only two people feel safe there's enough of you guys that
don't feel safe to where you're not getting the hard or doing the work that
you need to for kids like there's no way that you're all going to get to the
point of like everybody being on board with the strategic learning design if we
have this type of barrier it's just not gonna happen and it has to be done in a
very authentic intentional way and then all of you just really agreeing that I'm
going to ask a question before I make a claim or even as you're examining the
question that you're going to ask is like am I making a claim am I pointing
the finger at someone and it gets you out of the accusatory state right
because I will tell you I'm gonna move ahead here because I'm not going to get
it. But really we talk about research shows that boards impacts an achievement.
We know that the work that you do definitely impact. We talked about this
all night. We know that effective boards focus on data, effective data, data that
touches all our kids, right? And they use that data to develop unity with the
superintendent, right? Not being uniform but being unified to Lance's point. And
And then the precision point that we need to get to is where is that relationship between interpersonal trust,
meaning trust within this group, can turn into governance discipline,
meaning how we show up in the boardroom and how we present ourselves to the public,
that focuses on student gains.
And that's the gains that you're looking for, and that's the gains that you're looking for.
How is all that input, and that's why it matters.
And then do we even believe that this is a thing? We're supposed to level set.
So best practices and best research says that your community sees you at work,
your community knows that you're doing the right work when all these things are
in alignment, right? So on the school board trustee side, what the governance
means, you guys develop the means, which is the mission and vision, you develop
the goals, you develop the posse, you set the parameters around the budget, and
then so you're establishing the what the where the how much and you're the bridge
between the community and superintendent so you authorize and you monitor right
superintendent manages right they have a team that manages the methods the
strategy the action plans the procedures but there's mutual respect and trust
when there's alignment right when this can come and report oh no go back oh
this one those fancy ones I don't know anything about that. Innovation. The how, the who, the when, and where and it's a bridge between the staff and the board. So the
board, the superintendent recommends and you guys set through your through your
strategic vision and mission says hey you know these are our our focus goals
for this year or for the three years. They recommend based on that you guys
authorize it and then you monitor what they're implementing.
So the cover states this is where we're going to level set and you
don't have to agree with this tonight because next time we meet we'll come
back and we'll level set on this again to see if this is how you feel but this
is what best practice says where you get the most trust and respect from the
community when these things are in alignment. Now that does not mean that
there should not be transparency. That does not mean that there should not be
systems that should be regularly looked at about how we are getting feedback how
are we getting input that should not mean that we're not reaching those those
schools that have not quite rose risen all the way to the top it's just how you
do it right we'll talk about that later I want to talk about this all right so
like I said my planning and research team really four lovely ladies are
really smart led by my director curriculum instruction Susan Elliott we
We watched all your meetings, right?
And so from all your meetings, on average, they last two hours and 32 minutes.
On average.
Those are all meetings, work sessions and special.
Regular meetings, two hours and 38 minutes, right, across the 11 recordings.
Work-study sessions, again, around that two hours and 40 minutes, right?
Good chunk of time.
That's great.
What we broke down is that roughly 20 to 35 percent of that is focused on student
outcomes. The remaining 65 to 80 percent is focused on recognitions, public comment,
and adult-driven conversations. And there's some other actions that are
governance actions but they don't correlate directly to student outcomes. And so we
We just bring you that data, sort of like an ending piece to sort of think about why
it's important to first of all have a conversation around like are we aligned with focusing on
student outcomes and student focus, which is what you all said you are.
And you all are all in the monitoring spaces, which those are big wins.
Sometimes we have to come and do a sorting activity with boards to get them to understand
like what's the difference between being operationalized and being in that monitoring role.
We didn't have that issue tonight.
Like you guys are all solid in that monitoring piece, which is why we eliminated that piece of the exercise and went on to the other piece.
The issue that our concern is now is based on this data.
So the meeting, so your board meetings are not of the public, but they are in the public, right?
And so your agendas drive what your discussion was, drives what your work is.
So I just want you to think about how we can better shift those discussions to being focused more around student outcomes and how that looks in agenda development, but also in your input.
And it sort of correlates to what you've been saying.
I don't know if y'all kind of got that.
It's kind of based on, it sort of correlates.
We don't have clarity around how these schools are doing.
We don't have clarity around what this plan means here.
here so maybe that's what's driving some of these other questions I don't know
but I want you guys to just think about what those implications could possibly
be yes ma'am okay so on the recognitions part of it you don't consider when we're
talking about students who have achieved major goals so that's a great question
so when my team look at this we list specifically on what are those agenda
items that directly correlate to student outcomes. Recognitions are great. I think
we heard everyone say, recognitions are great, but when we're talking about
actual items that you're actually conducting the work of it, like I mean
and we're going to continue to do recognitions, right? That's just a good
thing to do. Like that's what we should be doing because lawmakers look at that
and all those things, right? But I know that recognitions are not covering up
65 to 80 percent of that like some of that you know so I will tell you this
one piece of data that we did not put up there and the original lands I told you
the wrong number I said you it was 49 minutes it's actually 52 Susan called me
so on average 52 minutes of every board meeting is taking up with adult
conversations so I mean well I think Amy has alluded to it like when I ask a
question there's back and forth there that maybe should not be right or maybe
shit I don't know that's for your board to decide but what I'm saying is it
could be interfering with your focus on student outcomes and student achievement
and right now it's manageable but if gone unchecked you know so if gone
unchecked can you know what acts not around anymore you know
some of that 52 minutes in public speaking okay you're talking about the
conversation because you're counting yeah well I'm counting public comment
as how they index because what they do is they look at the whole they look at
the entirety of the meeting and then they broke it up into sections and then
they will bring it down even more and if you guys have other questions I can go
and have them will it will it down even more because I do I mean that's one
thing my curriculum and instructional design team and my research and
branding team are top-notch. Susan and her team does an amazing job of really
breaking down great level. What I love though is it does highlight that you
were one of the only districts that really did a lot of focus and public
agendas on HB3 and the outcomes there. Like that's something that was pointed
out in the data that I wanted to highlight that that was something that
we didn't find in other districts right. So just thinking about this if you're
thinking about why is this work important and why the work that we're
doing is critical just I would say use this as one of your takeaways as you
leave here this evening. How long was your review? For the whole year. This year? Yes. So we looked at all 11 so there was 11 board
meetings in the year 2024-25. The school year? School year, yes. Okay so you went off
calendar year school correct academic yes there okay so if you did work study
and regular that would be more than that correct more than 11 yeah 23 23 is right
there yeah so regular meetings were 11 and thank you for keeping me honest so
that adult conversation piece I know that we talked about like that
psychological aspect and all those things and how does this work when
you're having those adult conversations and to Amy's what she stated it feels
like that we constantly have the questions asked again and again in order
to write a narrative with certain members of the public in order to score
points and their political points oftentimes to either platform ourselves
or to de-platform someone else in kind of a disparaging way and sometimes it's
said with a smile and that's not at all what it means. It's a smile with a knife behind
someone's back and those are traps laid in order for you to answer the
question in a way that it's framed in a way that there is no right answer and so
that's why I said that I know the setup it's yeah it's a set up and so when I
say no I don't have a problem with the disagreement that's why because I know
that regardless of what I say it is going to be framed and manipulated and
taken in a way that I didn't mean so I just have to let that go and I had to
learn that real early. That you just gotta let it go and you gotta say what you mean,
you gotta read what you say. Or if you ask a question, you are trying to destroy public
education and that is not true. Yes. So, it's not true. Any disagreement is... You cannot
ask questions that it's just, it's not the key way and I grew up here and that is not
right. You should be able to ask questions. We've got a problem. We are facing a big problem
country because we have not been asking questions and it's okay to ask questions
you need to be respectful and you need to be you need to be mindful of how you
ask them but it's okay to ask questions you live in a free country and it's okay
and it's not it it's absolutely you are very much punished by administration and
by the other board members if you ask any questions so can can I ask you one
one more question sir. How important is it for you in your role for each of your
trustees to bring their best selves into a room? Yeah I think that's just what we
got to do on any team. That's just how a team functions. Athletic team, sports
teams, every team that you put together you got to bring your best self after
every game. And so what we're hearing from the conversations around you know
feeling safe about having courageous conversations and you know you know
feeling like setups or reprobation like it creates a situation where you can't
bring your best self but you know it's hard to bring and I need all policymakers
who are making decisions about kids and their future to like bring like have
the ability to bring their best it matters to bring your best self so we're
gonna have to work on that and understand that a criticism is not or a
critique is not a personal attack when I critique something or I question
something or I slightly criticize something that doesn't mean that I think
public education as a whole is just awful that's not what I'm saying I'm
saying I look at it doesn't mean I'm personally attacking any one person
That's not how it's perceived. So what if I, if that's how you feel, that's how you feel.
Doesn't mean I'm not going to ask the question. If you're offended, then you're allowed to be offended.
That's okay. But that doesn't have to then stop me from then asking the question just because you get offended.
That's not how it's going to work.
Well, I always get, Jason and I get very nervous when there are superintendents that we work with that don't want questions.
It makes us very nervous because your job is to ask.
I don't even necessarily think that it's always our superintendent that doesn't like questions.
It's maybe his team.
Well, he can work that out real quickly.
I think there are four members that don't like questions.
Well, it's both.
So, we're going to work together to have Lance lead us through some of those things.
But I want to thank everyone.
Do you have any way to or did your team think about if the question or if the
conversations were politically motivated at all? We didn't look that deep into it
what we were just trying to look at like I literally it was does that
conversation support or promote student outcomes like that's and if it didn't it
didn't make the mark right and even I went back and listened to some of the
the conversations that Renee had red flag to say because you know some of it
you know but it was like at the end of the day did the end result of it result
in a vote that promoted student outcomes or if it promoted an action or even
there was some there were some give me's like one about directing Ken to take
action on something right like that promoted but you know so we didn't get
into that part of it because our thing was we just really try to get you know
where the attention goes energy flows you know sort of philosophy like if you
if it's on your agenda and if it's in alignment with a plan that everybody is
sort of on board with and if they have attached before they can like actually
link an objective to how it's impacting a community or a school like those are
the types of things that we like to measure out but not for this case but
you know I'm sure we try to stay away from that as much as possible and plus people
perceive to live in different and different regions and it can get really
messy but it's we're about at 830 and it's okay with you Mr. President we're
gonna stop here so a couple things we didn't get to we didn't get to the
commitments that's okay we'll work on a plan with Lance for our next
scheduled time and then we'll also be looking at your board self-assessment
and sort of continue to do this work but in the meantime Lance and I will do some
work around what we've accomplished today but I want to tell each and
everyone you and I'll let Jason do his clothes but I want to thank each and
every one of you for your grace and your time not everyone understands the
commitment and the sacrifice and I know I keep saying that and I say that
because I work with board members all the time and people don't understand the
community doesn't understand. I live vicariously through Jason's
political career, like running his campaigns and campaigning for him,
and the struggles with his family, so I see it from that perspective, but I truly
thank you all for your service and your attention and your participation tonight.
Thank you, and thank you for allowing me to come in and be a part of this.
Ken, thank you. Your staff and team is always amazing. Mr. President, thank you
I'll pass it on to you Jason. You know I'll say the same thing. Thanks for allowing us the opportunity
to come and work with you guys.
I keep up not nearly as close as everyone
maybe around here. But I can tell you that I feel more hopeful than
when I came in here. Which may mean nothing to you, but
the work that was talked about, there's something there and I'm excited about it.
So I appreciate you all's time.
Oh, one second. You said you had three micro behaviors, you only gave us two.
Oh, I only gave you two?
My notes are incomplete.
The other one is like, really assume positive intent, right? Assume a positive intent, but also taking a moment to write the person's question down before you respond to it.
what's the other micro piece like write the person's question there's research
that says if you just write the person's question down as they're asking you it
gives you time to reset yourself so that there's not so much of an emotional
response some people say breathing treatments
I don't think that worked for me.
Should we bring our birthday amazing?
That's right.
Rough work.
Oxygen, rough work.
Well, Robert, Jason, thank you all for being here tonight.
Thank you all for setting us up in a different location.
We appreciate it.
We didn't get a chance to share.
They were having college tonight at the Key Center tonight.
And so just to be in a different location where we weren't dealing with traffic and
parking and all that kind of stuff, we chose to do it here.
There being no further business before the board, this meeting's adjourned.
The time is 826 p.m.
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